Daniel Hubmann at the LOC National event today

[RichT]

I believe I'm correct in saying that anyone who went through the punching start has a correct time. The majority of people who went through the timed start will have a first leg split that is 1min 4secs too fast due to the start clock being in advance of the the times in the boxes.

This adjustment to the results is currently being worked through.

[Homer]

I wonder what Daniel thought of our "National Event"?

I was left with the impression of a large district event with a few people from further afield than the usual Lakes event.
The parking was adequate, just; we arrived early and so weren't faced with the extra km's walk. Also the narrowness of the track and dead-end/u-turning arrangement meant it was congested both as a pedestrain and a driver.
The assembly area was minimal to say the least. A lay-by on a forest track with enough room for Wilf's and CompassPoint. The finish was remote (as is usual for the Lakes) and consisted of a control on the moor with a man sat next to it.

I'm not intending to criticise LOC particularly, but more to raise the question of what minimum features should we expect of an event labelled as a National Event? (as opposed to a normal Regional Event)
I would expect the following:
1. A proper assembly area (ideally with the finish in it).
2. Car parking on forest roads only as last resort (and definitely without everyone having to turn round). Bussing from a field somewhere is fine.
3. Controls and punches on stakes. The use of SI boxes on the ground is OK for district events but poor form at National Events.

I thought LOC's event was an excellent event, but was left wondering what we got extra above a standard Regional Event (I seem to remember paying a national event entry fee rather than a regional event fee). The map certainly hadn't had (or needed) a professional update for many years.

I've not been to a Swiss National Event, but would be very interested to compare notes with anyone who has. Does Mr Hubmann read this forum?!!

[Jethro]

Afraid I have to disagree with Homer's assessment of what makes a national event. Meeting the three criteria listed on some crappy, bramble infested area further south may attract higher numbers but that has more to do with geography than any inherent value as a "National" event. The parking arrangements may not have been ideal on sunday but I for one am quite happy to put up with such minor inconveniences if I can be sure of a top class area and good planning.

[marcus_weatherburn]

Yer I agree with you Jethro, Caw was a great area im sure most of you will agree with me. I would far prefer a good area to run on and have to sacrifice a few minor things like parking, assembley etc. The area was great and the courses were excellent. At the end of the day orienteering is about the terrain and courses isnt it? not other minor things such as above.

[schnitzer]

Meeting the three criteria listed on some crappy, bramble infested area further south may attract higher numbers

A quick computer aided count of the pre-entries reveals 626 which IMO is OK for a National Event.

Let's not get Nationals confused with festivals of orienteering like the JK and Scottish 6-Days where the sort of criteria that Homer has listed are very important - huge car park, club tents, tannoy etc.

I think the parking worked quite well - yes you have to take more time but then even if you get out quickly then you just drive str8 into the back of a queue of caravans that sometimes even the schnitzer can't deal with.

The SI boxes on the ground without stakes is a Lake District norm and I agree - make it easier to get the controls out in mountainous areas and hopefully have more of them. Also it means you have to get closer to see the code which encourages better nav.

[woodpecker]

Parking on forest roads was unavoidable, I would have thought. Small price to pay for such a great area.
As for control boxes being on the floor - hardly worth the grumble when you've only 8 controls in nearly 7km! This was cool! (I planned Kilnsey last year and tried to acheive the same effect, but many people found that a bit tedious - here at Caw, you had to keep thinking nearly 100% of the time.)
Moreover the terrain was wonderfully fast.
Feel sorry for those people who entered and couldn't make it. However, if they'd all turned up the walk from the cars would have been even longer...
Mmmm... not so sorry for those people who didn't even enter.

[Carnage Head]

Great event - seemed to run like clockwork from my point of view as a competitor and as a teacher taking a few children to the race. There was certainly no need for a warm-up once you'd reached the start line. Regarding SI boxes on ground - fine - not much of an issue really, and imagine how much easier it must have been to lay out the controls!

Shame I missed out on the closing date by a couple of days. Still, I need a Light Green every now and again to persuade myself that I can navigate. It also gave me probably the only chance I'll ever get to beat seven-time Jack Bloor Fell Race and World Masters Mountain Champs medallist Greg Hull... (apologies for self-centred post - had to boast to someone...)

[lakesorunner]

Picking up on various points...
Map - was digitised and added to the existing OCAD map of Stickle. Whilst it didn't require much checking, there were a number of anomolies such as the size in OCAD of most of the features which on the existing map were non-standard size. A huge amount of work went in to getting a map that was as readable as possible whilst on the run.
Parking - any better suggestions? Bussing??? Oh really... The nature of Caw is a highly remote hill, with poor/no access from most sides. Bussing is just not an option.
Timing - the results are now posted, and everyone who went through the main start (and didn't punch a Start box) has 1min 04secs added to their time - Race time and the time in the boxes got out of synch somewhere... sorry(':oops:')
Assembly area - what do you want there that was missing?

[lilywhite]

Assembly area - what do you want there that was missing?

The finish.

[Tatty]

Aire seem to have made a good sining!!

[Liam]

Yea I was pretty surprised when I looked on the BarrO event entries list and saw Daniel Hubmann was in aire

[seabird]

As Aire team captain I'm even more surprised.

[jarkko_01]

Hj

[Roger]

I thought that the area was great and the planning was excellent. No problem with the arrangements for parking and assembly.

The one 'glitch' that affected me was the extent of the map. While puzzling over the best route for the leg over/round Caw itself, which was 9-10 on course 4, I paid insufficient attention to the long south-westerly leg 7-8, drifted left, and ended up off the map -- as it turned out, by about 50m. This was particularly confusing as there were controls and competitors from other courses round where I was. Took a while to realise that although I was on the mapped area I didn't have this bit on my map, and then to relocate once I'd got back onto it. If I'd had on my map the 'parallel' col - rocky slope - pond - small hill - crags where I ended up then I wouldn't have suffered such a swingeing penalty. So a plea: unless there's a clear boundary on the ground, for a 1.5km leg towards the edge of the map some competitors will need / appreciate more than 200m 'margin of error'.

Despite this I thoroughly enjoyed the weekend, including the previous day on Stickle Pike, and it was well worth the long trip. Many thanks to LOC and BarrO.

[OCM45]

Ah, the joy of RouteGadget.... Roger can run off the map (his map) yet go online and accurately draw his route on the extended map now available!

Whilst I didn't go to Caw I was very impressed with the routes on RouteGadget for Roger's course 4 leg 9-10. There are currently 9 versions uploaded and 9 vastly different routes. The easternmost is fully one kilometre away from the westernmost with 7 intermittently in between.