Yvette Baker Trophy

[distracted]

Provisional results are online at http://www.cix.co.uk/~neper/ybt2006/

Congratulations due to Deeside, with Octavian Droobers, Bristol and Sarum not too far behind...

[mharky]

4 men on the brown DSQ, all for missing #4, all of them are (or were) Southampton members... what's going on???

[tendon]

Obviously over-familiarity with Emit, couldn't be anything else

[Axel]

Light Green course had control 151 as their fifth control, No 4 on Brown course and only one runner had a problem there. Infact the person retired before or at that control. Couldn't have been anything wrong as Green course had over 134 that went through 151 with no problem.

[djc]

Three of them started within a minute of each other which might give you a clue as to what happened! Shan't complain as that little train then proceeded to catch me up...

[Paulo]

Yes, 3 of the 4 of us all decided to punch the Blue course control on the pond, which did look a bit like the pit we were looking for - although to be fair it was about 100m north of our control...

I was relying on the other 2 who were marginally ahead of me at that time to check the code. Ahem.

[DM]

AIRE qualified via the NW Watergrove event.

Can anyone give a the reason why after taking the trouble to qualify they don't enter a team in the final?

[RJ]

I think I can speak for the team, thanking the organisers for a great day.... they all thoroughly enjoyed the competition and the forest. It was so good to be in a relatively small section of the forest, in what was a mass of paths, tracks and rides. Great fun. Being from the NW we had to have a little practice with EMIT before the day, but we all coped OK.

Congratulations to DEE on the win. We had left before that happened.... leaving it to the last few runners... a bit close that!!

This was our first outing to the YBT final, and with a relatively small and inexperienced team. It has fired them all up to try again next year. Thanks. However, travel to the qualifier at Watergrove and the final at Newbury has cost the club a fortune.... and is not something that can be contemplated year on year.

BTW.... what was the idea of all those "oldies, ancients and wrinklies" gatecrashing on the junior event. They just have to get a run don't they... they can't leave the event to the juniors!! This is one of the 'selfish' moulds that need to be broken if the sport is to move on and develop. They just looked so out of place on the day. Did they all stay to cheer the juniors in.... did they heck!

Not trying to criticise Mike N but it would have been good to see the results posted in classes rather than colour course... anyway, all the displays I saw were in colour course listing. And what happened to that big screen with the club scores that has appeared at previous events?

[Knee Deep Mud!]

all those "oldies, ancients and wrinklies" gatecrashing on the junior event

I think it was actually the other way round, with the YBT 'gatecrashing' an already arranged district event.

[distracted]

Whether X was gatecrashing Y is irrelevant - the fact is that the emphasis at the event was clearly on the Yvette Baker Trophy. The "oldies" were forced to start early, giving the YBT the prominence it deserved - the runners had their own start block, commentary and radio controls were provided solely for those running the trophy courses etc. And I imagine they all had a good day out and enjoyed themselves!

If the organising club can/is providing a district event on top all well and good, as long as there is some sort of separation between the two. It's good, and necessary, to have the spotlight on the juniors for once - as has been said time and time again they are the future of the sport. And this is the sort of event, with the focus on club and team spirit, that hopefully brings in and keeps people orienteering.

[awk]

AIRE qualified via the NW Watergrove event.

Can anyone give a the reason why after taking the trouble to qualify they don't enter a team in the final?

Very simply, the club couldn't get a reasonably representative team together. None of our schools were available because of the distance, most of our better older juniors were away, ill or simply unwilling to make the journey down to Newbury again such a short space of time after the CSCup Final (especially with a string of squad weekends, selection races etc. in between), whilst younger juniors families were on the whole not prepared to go that far.

It was disappointing, but not unexpected - we're finding less and less people are willing to travel the big distances so often, there are simply too many competitions on the calendar now, and this autumn has been very busy for quite a number of families. For us as a family it was a welcome break - the first time in months without an orienteering commitment at the weekend.

[Mr timE]

RJ said: Not trying to criticise Mike N but it would have been good to see the results posted in classes rather than colour course

Don't understand fully what you mean here RJ as the YBT is based on courses, with a number of classes able to count on each. The Guidelines says: Courses used in each match are Yellow, Orange, Light Green, and Green. On the Green any junior can count from M/W10 up to M/W20.

By splitting the results out into classes you would lose any meaning as an individual's score for their club is based on their position relative to all the others on that course, not just their class. What Michael did do was produce results showing YBT only runners and they were on a separate board from the CC results which showed everyone, incl we "boring old farts".

On the issue of combined events I suggest you ask those parents/helpers who had to give up their time to bring the kids all the way down here again, whether they appreciated the chance to also have a run. Team coaches I am sure will benefit from knowing exactly what the terrain was like when they do their post mortems and from the organising club perspective if you are going to provide all those facilities it makes sense to maximise on revenue, which also means costs are spread wider and therefore the entries can be kept down for the YBT. Toilet costs for 650 were not much more than for 400 as usage was spread over the whole day. PA system & radio control costs are the same whether 350 or 650. Some of the early runners did hang around for a while to watch the youngsters, I think it was the change in the weather that sent most of them away.

[Tatty]

One problem that arose this year was Qualifying heats being organised on inappropriate dates. I spoke to several different clubs to find that 3 heats had been organised on Half Term weekends when many/most of other potentially participating clubs children were unavailable. Our own Regional heat only had the organising club participating!! Another Region organised their heat on the Junior Lakeside weekend, when other clubs, and presumably their own, 16 year olds were in the Lake District. It was unfair to ask these children to make the decision to leave one of their main training/social weekends for the YBT. This needs to be addressed for future years. How can we do this? Obviously from reading AWK's thread we need to consider timimg and venue of the Final. AIRE not being there was a loss to the competition, as they would have been one of the leading contenders.

[RJ]

Don't understand fully what you mean here RJ as the YBT is based on courses, with a number of classes able to count on each.

As they are shown in the final results.... by scoring class..... http://www.cix.co.uk/~neper/ybt2006/

....Team coaches I am sure will benefit from knowing exactly what the terrain was like when they do their post mortems

Knowing what the terrain is like and where various controls are BEFORE the juniors race...????.... I call that cheating.

Distracted rightly draws attention to the fact that the juniors ARE the future of the sport. So, what investment are we all prepared to make in ensuring the sport DOES HAVE A FUTURE. Are we prepared to forego a run and help transport, coach, look after and cheer in our junior team at their own special event? There are too many 'selfish' attitudes in the sport. Look after me first and then we will see if I have the time and energy to do anything else!

[Mrs H.]

Knowing what the terrain is like and where various controls are BEFORE the juniors race...????.... I call that cheating.

My goodness - I wouldn't be you when big Nev sees that!

In my observation very few of the adults associated with the YBT took a run - as I was involved with all the jobs you describe I certainly wouldn't have had the energy or the inclination but a public race before hand obviously helps the host club provide the extras - like the finish arch etc and it was certainly done last year.

I think by far a greater threat to the competition was the serious under-mining by BOF itself by holding a junior squad weekend at the same time - and then - if reports are to be believed - compounding the misdemeanour by inviting Start squaddies to join it as well.

It is no fair to put young people in the position of having to chose their club ( which may have nurtured and supported them for years) or the squad - I know of at least two YBt finalists who went to the Lakes on Saturday - ran 12 k and travelled for 9 hours to represent their club - maybe they are too conscientious for their own good - but they should not have been put in that position in the first place by a governing body which should have their best interests at heart.