tour de farce

[the duncan]

tried to do my best landis breakaway last night up mount keen, but it was too steep and i had to carry my bike!
awesome atge yesrteray, think today will be pretty dull in comparison. 30seconds to get, can he do it in the timt trial!

[Adventure Racer]

If I'd actually condoned the use of drugs you might have a point, Gross. As it is I think you should retract your post for resorting to personal abuse. Obviously your time in foreign lands has dulled your ability to comprehend the meaning and context of written English.

[Gross]

wasn't me who said they didn't care if drugs were used or not because it makes it more exciting.

That is definately a statement that is not 'anti drugs in sport'

If you are happy that drugs are used to make sport more exiting then so be it!

[the duncan]

temper temper children!!!

[Adventure Racer]

wasn't me who said they didn't care if drugs were used or not because it makes it more exciting.

Wasn't me either.

[Gross]

I actually no longer care whether they're all on drugs or not. This is just so exciting it simply doesn't matter any more!

???????????????????

[Adventure Racer]

"because"?

[Gross]

you clearly said you no longer care if they are on drugs or not. You also clearly said that it's so exciting that it doesn't matter.....

You should retract any statements that implies any thing to do with the use of drugs in sport.

Excitment in sport is caused by (among other things) high performance & at the level of proffessional sport high performance means more money which leads to more media coverage which creates a demand for higher performance. Drugs enhance performance.

Any statement that implies that it doesn't matter if drugs are used if the excitement levels are high is totally irresponsible.

There are plenty of kids etc that read internet forums and if they see one of the top adventure racers saying they don't mind if drugs are used it could well have an unwanted effect.

You may or may not have meant what you wrote but you certainly wrote what you wrote and I (along with the vast majority of orienteers) disagree strongly in that there can never be an excuse for using drugs to enhance performance in sport.

Last words from me

[Adventure Racer]

OK, if I really have to explain what I wrote, because you still don't understand:

Drugs is a big issue in cycling - particularly so this year when a big scandal beforehand resulted in the two big favourites pulling out. I've written before on this (in this thread and elsewhere), so I thought my views were fairly clear. Unfortunately the drugs issue has got so big that it even overshadows the cycling itself - such that somewhere back up there I said I was struggling to get interested, given it all seemed so tainted. Whenever somebody has a good performance in cycling, almost inevitably the fingers will be pointed (as I'm sure they will after yesterday - I have to admit to a small suspicion myself, sadly).

There is a huge difference between saying "I no longer care" to meaning "it's alright if they are". The former is putting aside the suspicions and accepting it as the great spectacle it is and allowing myself to pretend it is all clean just for a little while, and ignoring all the other stuff going on. What "doesn't matter any more" is all the drugs scandals going on, as it can no longer detract from the cycling when the cycling itself is so spectacular, given that the assumption has to be made that the riders involved are innocent in the absence of any evidence against them. Yes there is still the lingering suspicion (thanks for making me take it all so seriously and spoiling it!) You'll note I never said "because" anywhere - in fact I believe that drug free cycling is likely to be more exciting, as it exposes peoples human frailties much better.

[DIDSCO]

AR > you've gotta admit mate what you wrote sounded alot more positive towards drugs than against.

Don't understand why so many people get so excited about the tour de france. We all know its the most corrupt sporting event there is and that the majority of riders are drug cheats. Wheres the big thrill?

[Adventure Racer]

You're right, Dids. It didn't quite come out right. Not exactly pro-drug, and doesn't excuse Gross for suggesting I said something which I didn't.

I'd have to take issue with it being the most corrupt spoorting event and the majority being drugs cheats though. Did you miss the bit I wrote earlier about there being 200 on the books of the Spanish doctor, only 50 or so of which were cyclists, yet all the other sporting bodies seem happy that it doesn't affect them? Does hiding the problem mean it doesn't actually exist for these other sports? Given this situation, at least we know where we are with cycling, which is the most tested sport in the world (and personally I still think most of those riding this year are clean), but I'm pretty suspicious about the idea that all the other sports out there are clean. Anyway, for corruption in sport it appears you have to look no further than the world's biggest (at least in terms of hype) sport, where it appears you can get away with only a 9 month ban for something which would result in a 2 year ban in cycling.

[FatBoy]

Chris - it didn't come out right but anybody who was watching/listening yesterday knew what you meant - i.e. lets ignore the whole drug scandal for a second and admire a fantastic day of sport.

As you say cycling is the most tested sport in the world so let's hope all those involved in the spectacle are doing stuff by the book.

So looks like today was a coast for all the big players - I'm slightly surprised that Pereiro and Sastre are willing to let it all come down to the time trial given Landis' form in the previous one, but looks that way. I'm not predicting anything though!

[HOCOLITE]

Anyway, for corruption in sport it appears you have to look no further than the world's biggest (at least in terms of hype) sport, where it appears you can get away with only a 9 month ban for something which would result in a 2 year ban in cycling.

Did you mean Angling or fox hunting

[Alice]

Landis did really well yesterday to pull back all that time. There are only 30 seconds between the top three riders i think. It is nice that the competition is a bit more open this year.

[ifor]

Knowing what AR had previously said I read the comment yesterday with no problem, looking at it stand alone though I can see why there was some trouble. I spent most of yesterday late afternoon trying to avoid knowing exectly what happened. I then watched 4 hours of eurosport coverage last night. Realy compelling vewing, did not get to bed till 1am.

The one occasion I think where somthing similar happend was in the 80s when Bernard Heno (know idea of the spelling) and the other person competing with him that year Fingon? Broke away from everybody for the hole day and just distanced themselves form the peleton sluging it out up evey hill.

Ifor