Mandatory crossing points

[Gnitworp]

I saw two people notusing a marked, mandatory fence crossing point on the north edge of a field in the middle south of the BOC map (e.g. between controls 4 and 5 on M60L). The fence was not barbed and very easy (and tempting)to cross, especially if you inadvertently hit it away from the crossing point.

I dutifully diverted to the crossing point and saw another competitor on my course gain ground on me by not using it.

I have the feeling I may not have been observing a totally isolated incident.

Comments please.

[mat-d]

sounds familiar...

It really depends on the organiser/planner's thoughts on the subject and the info given about crossing points in the details and probably most importantly the amount of time gained.

[NeilC]

The fence was not barbed, but on Friday morning at least the electic top wire was still live. The fence wasn't that easy to cross actually and we felt that there was a serious risk of damage to the fence if people attempted to climb it hence we built the stiles and made them mandatory.

Unfortunately there will always be a minority of competitors who will break the rules in order to gain an advantage. Rather than constrain courses by putting controls by these crossing points I suspect the only solution is to have marshalls policing the course.

[Gnitworp]

The fence was not barbed, but on Friday morning at least the electic top wire was still live. The fence wasn't that easy to cross actually and we felt that there was a serious risk of damage to the fence if people attempted to climb it hence we built the stiles and made them mandatory.

Unfortunately there will always be a minority of competitors who will break the rules in order to gain an advantage. Rather than constrain courses by putting controls by these crossing points I suspect the only solution is to have marshalls policing the course.

Do you constrain the courses by having controls on crossing points every competitor will pass?

The only way to force competitors to use a crossing point is to place a control marker on it. If everyone will pass it anyway the course is in no way compromised and fairer.

At the very least crossing points should on the obviously quickest route between controls so advantage can not be illicitly gained. Planners should not kowtow to cheats, and in the heat of battle we're all tempted. You also preserve good relations with landowners.

[Gnitworp]

In the 1997 Edition of the BOF Rules and Guidelines my last post is pretty much endorsed in Guideline 19, specifically in G19.4.1 Compulsory Crossing Points

I can find no equivalent in the current BOF Rules, Appendices or Event Guidelines.

Anyone know why?

[guest]

Not everyone carries around a copy of the final details with them in the forest. If crossing the fence is not permitted, it should be marked as such on the map that the competitor will have with them during their run, using the approprioate IOF symbol - a solid purple line along the line of the fence. See bottom left corner of page 12 of the following document http://www.britishorienteering.org.uk/documents/map_isom2000.pdf
It was not marked as such on the BOC maps, so whilst running I would consider that it is perfectly acceptable to assume that you can cross it. A note in the final details is not really good enough for mandatory iinstructions like this, particularly when there is an approved way of showing it on the map.

Mind you it would probably not have mattered even if it had been correctly marked. During the short open relay I saw all of the pack of six people in front of me take the route choice down the road that was clearly marked as out of bounds on the map, and I'm sure a lot of others did the same, as it was a much faster route choice than the in bounds light green forest. (In their defence though, I didn't see the continuous tapes that the map indicated should be there to stop people entering the OOB area (solid purple line at the edge of the OOB area on the map)).

[tendon]

(In their defence though, I didn't see the continuous tapes that the map indicated should be there to stop people entering the OOB area (solid purple line at the edge of the OOB area on the map)

Planners comments will make reference. I felt that the south side of the road/verge was a sufficiently solid feature to make the OOB clear - but wanted it to be understood that the OOB included the verge, not just the road surface, hence the addition of the solid line just inside the forest "marked continuously on the ground" (by the road edge itself - "etc") ... ignoring the bulge to the east

Anyone on the road was quite obviously in the OOB, regardless of the line or otherwise - no defence.

This spoilt the day for me - I stood on the corner for an hour or more directing people into the forest and some still tried to run round me onto the road. Why?

Perhaps someone who did use the road route would like to explain their decision to take this "option".

[Godders]

This is one of my pet hates about British orienteering.

The map should use the correct symbols as this is the only information you have while running. Sadly it is very rare for the "you are not allowed to cross" symbol to be used.

[MarkC]

This spoilt the day for me - I stood on the corner for an hour or more directing people into the forest and some still tried to run round me onto the road.

Did you note down their numbers so that you could disqualify the cheats then? I went straight rather than round the road and from the splits appear to have lost several minutes as a result...

On the other hand your intention of including the verge as well as the road surface was not entirely clear from the map, even looking at it afterwards - a possible interpretation could have been that the solid line was next to the road rather than overlaid on it to ensure that it was visible. If I had chosen to go round I would probably have followed the tarmac as closely as possible without actually stepping on it, in the absence of any tape.

A roll of tape tied along the edge of the trees would have been worth the effort to make it clear, given that the optimum route for some of the legs I saw was clearly to follow the path and the edge of the out of bounds and in a relay pack situation not everyone will have been concentrating that hard on the map.

[Ed]

This is one of my pet hates about British orienteering.

The map should use the correct symbols as this is the only information you have while running. Sadly it is very rare for the "you are not allowed to cross" symbol to be used.

one time I did use it (for a dry-stone wall)... and very few seemed to understand what it meant.

[tendon]

The verge was generally very narrow (0.5 metres), with some large trees and holly in it, so the option of following it wasn't an easy option anyway. Tracking back looking at foot prints, it was not really taken after the first 20 metres or so - to the first big tree where people either went in, or out. I'm disappointed that any (many) took the road.

[/quote]in a relay pack situation not everyone will have been concentrating that hard on the map

... to the extent that they didn't see that the road was OOB?

[tim sleepless]

The verge was generally very narrow (0.5 metres), with some large trees and holly in it, so the option of following it wasn't an easy option anyway. Tracking back looking at foot prints, it was not really taken after the first 20 metres or so - to the first big tree where people either went in, or out. I'm disappointed that any (many) took the road.

in a relay pack situation not everyone will have been concentrating that hard on the map

... to the extent that they didn't see that the road was OOB?

[/quote]

I'll hold my hand up and admit to taking this route. I haven't had my map back to see how it was marked. For whatever reason, and I was running behind people in a pack, it didn't register in my addled brain that it might be out of bounds until I was already well along it, and then I came to the conclusion that the verge was ok...

Never underestimate the potential stupidity of the orienteer --- particularly in a relay.

[Doug T]

i tried to cross the fence into the field mentioned above on my route to control 4 on m18l.
i wa forced to use the crossing point after i got an electric shock.

thought it was quite a good way of making people use the crossing points!

[tim sleepless]

i tried to cross the fence into the field mentioned above on my route to control 4 on m18l.
i wa forced to use the crossing point after i got an electric shock.

thought it was quite a good way of making people use the crossing points!

Wimp...

[tendon]

Never underestimate the potential stupidity of the orienteer --- particularly in a relay.

Or their ability to retain simple instructions?

From the relay programme:
"Safety & First Aid
The main and minor roads on the northern and eastern margins of the map are out of bounds for competitor’s safety."