BOC - Moan about entry costs

[plain lazy]

think you need to get some more quotes for your loos. I've just hired 15 for an event I'm running at £40 each for a weekend.

Blimey...that's cheaper than my council tax rates per weekend... i think i'll get one set up in my garden and charge the neighbours !

[Red Adder]

Guest wrote .."loudspeaker hire"
or sell "tape for run-ins etc".... (seriously!)
" hire tents"
provide "computers" "

I don't think any of these convince me as loud speakers generally don't enhance my o experience (I like my forest quiet) whilst my club provides sufficient tentage, finish tapes and computers for the e-punch results at district event within the £ 4 fee - as well as the normal essentialls such as levies / planners/controllers/organiser/helpers expenses and a new, overprinted bagged map. [And I know in EA all the other clubs offer similar excellent value at district events]

[tendon]

From the BOF website:

"BOF currently manages a budget of just under one million pounds a year. Over three quarters of this is either exchequer (taxation-funded) or Lottery grants from UK Sport or Sport England. The Lottery money funds the three World Class (international elite) programmes: Performance, Potential and Start. The exchequer grant from UK Sport meets most of the executive staff costs, and from Sport England the development of orienteering within England.

BOF's own money comes from membership fees (around £85,000 a year), and the event levy and major event (British Championship and JK) profits (around £95,000 a year)"

Note that is event levy for most events but profits from BOC and JK. In reality, there is an expectation on the quantum of money coming from BOC, which has a direct impact on the event entry level and (with JK) encorages a differential when compared with all other regular events, in addition to the exceptional costs associated with putting on an event that should provide a similar competition to the World Championships, loud speakers and all.

Fact is, if this extra BOF income isn't generated at JK and BOC, it would have to come from increased levys at all other events.

Take your pick, I guess

[mikey]

Here are some alternative activities for April 1st in the south.

Go and see Fulham - £38
Take part in the Questars Adventure race - £40
Run the South Coast 1/2 marathon - £20
Go and see Steptoe and Son at the Comedy Theatre - £35
Go and see Neil Sedaka in Brighton - £35

Or alternatively, just stay at home and do bugger all - £0

[guest]

Here are some alternative activities for April 1st in the south.

Go and see Fulham - £38
Take part in the Questars Adventure race - £40
Run the South Coast 1/2 marathon - £20
Go and see Steptoe and Son at the Comedy Theatre - £35
Go and see Neil Sedaka in Brighton - £35

Or alternatively, just stay at home and do bugger all - £0

...and for everything else there's Mastercard...

[ryeland of doom]

You mentioned watching Fulham...

That used to be affordable. I once watched a lot of football. I dont ever go now... Hung on for a while courtesy of a relegation to the Conference, but thats getting silly now.

Ditto anything else that gets expensive.

Face facts! Some of us dont earn very much, and have to make choices. Orienteering has a reputation for affordability, lets not lose that. If it gets too dear, then do something else. Easy! Vote with the feet.

Personally if entry to the BOC has to be restricted, lets restrict it on orienteering ability.

[SeanC]

Except that the numbers competing also affect cost.

If the current generation of over 40's orienteers are not replaced, how many people will be at the 2026 British Champs? 100? That wont cover the fixed costs unless the fees go up massively or the quality of the event declines markedly.

If the extra fees for the BOC are spent directly or indirectly recruiting new orienteers, then thats money well spend - even if just viewed on a purely economic basis.

Sorry, I said I wouldn't keep making this point, but I couldn't resist.

[LostAgain]

Here are some alternative activities for April 1st in the south.

Go and see Fulham - £38
Take part in the Questars Adventure race - £40
Run the South Coast 1/2 marathon - £20
Go and see Steptoe and Son at the Comedy Theatre - £35
Go and see Neil Sedaka in Brighton - £35

Or alternatively, just stay at home and do bugger all - £0

Is orienteering for the family competing with this or more likely:

Sunday Soccer £2.50 subs
Judo £3.00
Swimming £2.00
Rugby
etc. etc.

Orienteering is significantly more expensive, even before including travel costs, than the above and similar in kit costs.

[FatBoy]

Go and see Fulham - £38
Take part in the Questars Adventure race - £40
Run the South Coast 1/2 marathon - £20
Go and see Steptoe and Son at the Comedy Theatre - £35
Go and see Neil Sedaka in Brighton - £35

But cost of BOC is more than all of those once you've included and accommodation and petrol so your example isn't very good. I wouldn't travel from up here to down there to do any of those things.

Sunday Soccer £2.50 subs
Judo £3.00
Swimming £2.00
Rugby
etc. etc.

Your example is no good either because for example DVO informal on Saturday was cheaper than those, and indeed at the same level i.e. local low-key sport.

BOC is supposed to be one of the two pinnacles of our sport in the UK. If it turns out as such it is worth the £xxx I've spent/going to spend on it. If it doesn't turn out like that then we should be asking not why it is expensive but why was it poor. Time will tell.
[/quote]

[Adventure Racer]

Sunday Soccer £2.50 subs
Judo £3.00
Swimming £2.00
Rugby
etc. etc.

Your example is no good either because for example DVO informal on Saturday was cheaper than those, and indeed at the same level i.e. local low-key sport.

As indeed is this:

[Red Adder]

So for the cost of watching Fulham or Neil Sedaka I can attend 9 EA district events - not really a hard
call is it. :)

[roadrunner]

FatBoy wrote:

mikey wrote:

Go and see Fulham - £38
Take part in the Questars Adventure race - £40
Run the South Coast 1/2 marathon - £20
Go and see Steptoe and Son at the Comedy Theatre - £35
Go and see Neil Sedaka in Brighton - £35


But cost of BOC is more than all of those once you've included and accommodation and petrol so your example isn't very good.

But you'd have to travel to do any of those things, so it's not fair to include travel costs in one case and not the other - and as a football match and a 1/2 marathon take a similar time to an orienteering course, if you'd need an overnight stay to do one, then you would for the other as well, so again we should compare like with like.

[Carnage Head]

I think the punter is probably voting with his feet in reg v district debate. If you look at recent regional events the entry numbers are hardly stunning, particularly on junior courses. Either the sport is in general decline or people are deciding not to travel and pay higher fees for regional events when they can get similar from a district.

The latter notion is distinctly plausible, Hocolite. District events held by AIRE in recent months seem to be as popular, or even more popular than ones I remember going to a few years ago. Top class organisation and a laid-back feel combine with cheap entries and entry-on-the-day to give AIRE District events a feel of value for money, which attracts and retains many casual orienteers (whoever they might be!). Nevertheless, I feel that a tenner or so for a regional or national event once every month or so is not outrageous.

The one costly aspect of o which I think could be tackled better by increased co-ordination is transport and share-a-lift schemes. Does any club run an active share-a-lift scheme? (I appreciate I haven't used the AIRE one, usually due to sharing anyway, or taking school minibus.) Envt benefits too, of course. Or have any clubs thought of giving info about transfers from train stations to races? I feel guilty whenever I go on long car journeys... plus I am coming out of a long period of stinginess...

[awk]

Or have any clubs thought of giving info about transfers from train stations to races?

One of the negative effects of (a) events mainly on Sundays and (b) the failure of the rail operators to run a decent Sunday service (presumably assuming that people only travel by public transport to and from work!!), is that getting to and from events by train is all too often an exercise in futility, as found from bitter experience. By contrast, orienteering in Switzerland by public transport is so much easier because the Sunday services are so much better (largely the same as on weekdays). The transport is so much more strongly frequented too. Surprise, surprise: for instance, a half hourly weekday service on the Bradford-Ilkley line reduced to 2-hourly on Sundays is inevitably going to see people to resort to other methods of travel on that day.

[graeme]

But cost of BOC is more than all of those once you've included and accommodation and petrol so your example isn't very good. I wouldn't travel from up here to down there to do any of those things.

And once you consider your travel and accommodation (and Club/SOA/BOF membership) costs the £13 entry is pretty small potatoes. Orienteering is an expensive sport, entry fees are a very small part of the cost.

For under a fiver, you got Normans Law mapped professionally from the carpark and bashed into shape by a couple of amateurs. For a tenner you could join most of the M21s ferreting around unmarked crags in Dalbeattie before giving up. To some extent you get what you pay for I hope BOC will at least have a top quality map.

Who is the mapper?

Graeme