how others see us

[Adventure Racer]

I was about to retract what I said about children being rude in the face of Awk's logic, but then realised that in the context of the original post I am in a way correct - she's getting upset about children being rude to her and drawing the conclusion that therefore orienteers are an uncouth lot with poorly behaved children, when that is very evidently not the case from my experience at every orienteering event I've been to. Certainly lots of far worse children she could meet!

As I said before, it sounds like she went over the top - and two wrongs don't make a right - but the original fault was the orienteers'. No reason why she should be forced to walk in the road outside her own house even if it is only for one morning once a year. We really should be seen to be behaving well since we rely on the permissions of landowners to carry out our pasttime. Yes our impact is relatively small, but maybe we should consider that those people who live there have more right than we do.

Seeing the forum for the event - this isn't something I've seen for an event before (probably just not been looking), but what a good idea. Lots of other interesting comments on there.

Just as an aside - if she managed to find the event forum, she could just as easily find us here, and read everything we're writing about her!

[RJ]

to actually find out what the publics perception of orienteers is would be very difficult. .... I think we try our hardest to be friendly, considerate and courteous.

Do we have the slightest idea of the public's perception of us? Do we tell them, at all, ever, what we are about?

Newspaper reports would be an opportunity to enlarge on what we are about, and perhaps to draw reference to how we disturb the 'tranquility' of an area on a Sunday morning, once a year(!), and offer an apology(?). Should we be thinking about how we might be perceived?

We are undoubtedly friendly, considerate and courteous. We believe we are. But do we always get that across to the public; rushing as we do to get to the assembly area, or the start.

Worth a thought.... Roadworks.... we all hate them. But now the Highways Agency put up signs saying who they are, apologising for inconvenience, a telephone number, a website where you can complain. We have a better opinion of them subsequently because we have the opportunity to voice our concern somewhere.

Does 'O' need a bit of proactive PR work? It might improve our image, our membership and our participation.

[Ed]

Worth a thought.... Roadworks.... we all hate them. But now the Highways Agency put up signs saying who they are, apologising for inconvenience, a telephone number, a website where you can complain. We have a better opinion of them subsequently because we have the opportunity to voice our concern somewhere.

rubbish - we laugh at their pathetic PR effort, know that if we try complaining we'll just be given the usual blah about how important their work is and how we'll basically just have to put up with it because they're not changing what they do based on a few petty complaints, and curse the fact that it takes them so long and that they have to be digging up that particular road on that particular day, or more likely leaving a large amount of traffic cones blocking off 2 lanes of the motorway whilst the workers are having a coffee and a bacon sarnie in the nearest greasy spoon.

or is everyone else more impressed by a few superficial signs than I am?

[RJ]

The lady in question wrote:

Comment by Janet Ramsden of NA.
Submitted at 16:28 on Friday 10-Feb-2006.
SUBJECT: Discourtesy
As a resident of Norwood Green I have to voice my feelings on The Royds Hall Great Wood Event.
Vehicles parked on the pavement made life very difficult for pedestrians but even worse was the fact that not one orienteer offered to close car doors which were totally blocking the pavement. I admit to slamming them, I had a very elderly dog which I was not prepared to take into the road,the response from the car users was abusive. Even children saw fit to ask me why I objected to having to struggle to use the path.
A wheelchair bound friend at the top of the village found it impossible to get through.
As with previous events, the conclusion has to be that orienteers in general are a very inconsiderate, discourteous, self important group of people.
Many Judy Woods regulars have commented that it seems unfair that their quiet Sunday walk should be disrupted to this extent. Would it not be possible to use private estates?

she sounds like a bit of a nutter. ..... sounds like the woman who moved into a house next to my primary school and regularly complained about the noise from the playground.

Sorry..... she sounds very reasonable, and is being very polite in her criticism.


Ed, my point is.... the roadworks have to be done... we have to have our event on a Sunday morning... there is no harm in some PR to explain the facts!

[graeme]

Thanks for posting what was actually written. It seems both courteous and considerate, deserving of a reasoned response, witness that she clearly admits her own fault in slamming other peoples doors.

I'm rather afraid a lot of the comments here were made without bothering to look at what she actually wrote, a common trait on nopesport which is, as the lady says inconsiderate, discourteous and self important.

Graeme

[HOCOLITE]

I'm sure our orienteers would have been happy to complain if their cars had been scratched or dented by parking this way. It's a matter of thought! Re rude middle class children. In my experience a lot of the rude children are those who've been to private/public schools (not all by any means) but they assume every thing should be done for them the way they want it and nothing should get in their way. This is supported by someone I know who works at one of these schools. I have to work with the most pig arrogant chap who went to a minor public school, is not very academic but thinks everyone is inferior to him and should jump to his requests. Surprise surprise he doesn't have children.

[Rich]

I think she should be given a reasoned responce and an apology. She didn't help herself by slamming doors but parking on pavements is unacceptable at orienteering events in the first place. I also think an explanation of orienteering, wouldn't go a miss. Judging from the her last comment about using private estates she doesn't no much about the veriety of terrain we need and how dawn hard it is to get the permission to use alot of them in the first place.

[LostOldTimer]

Of course she had every right to complain. These orienteers were technically parked illegally. She would have been justified in contacting the police.

There are many inferm and disabled people around who have every right to use their local footapahs without hinderence. These orienteers who parked on the pavement should be ashamed of themeselves for doing so.
And she had every right to slam the doors of those people parked there, and not to expect the typical reaction of the majority (I am ashamed to say it but it is a majority) of orienteers who are middle class, and think themselves more important than everyone else.
PARKING:
With regard to parking - If there is a public car-park, anyone, including orienteers have a right to use it.
Why the need for so many parking officials at some events. Surely drivers are able to park their own cars? We dont need marshalls to park at Tesco's!
(If there are areas to avoid / not allowed to park in a field these can be taped off), but we are all intelligent to be able to park a car ourselves.
And why is it often the case that some early arrivals are parked the furthest away? No wonder many choose to park where they like.
And why the frequent rule of 'no vehicles will be allowed to leave the car park before 12.30'... I guess this is usually because of a narrow entry, and people may still be arriving... BUT you cannot physically stop anyone from leaving whenever they wish.

[Rich]

PARKING:
Why the need for so many parking officials at some events. Surely drivers are able to park their own cars? We dont need marshalls to park at Tesco's!

From the standard of parking you see at supermarkets I think they should have Marshalls. Daft idea not have marshalls at O events, it would be mayhem as there are no marked out bays.

[FatBoy]

Some people do need marshalling to park in Tesco's. Most orienteers will park as directed and will be happy to do so. A few times I've done car parking in public car parks I've found the vast majority of the "public" sharing the car park are happy to park tightly and where you ask them once you've explained it's going to get very full.

I don't believe that most orienteers feel they are more important than anyone else, nor do I believe that is a middle class trait, and furthermore that anyone can draw a line between working class and middle class any longer.

Let's put this one down to experience - we know where this woman lives so buy flowers, chocolates etc and apologise for a poor solution to a parking overflow, and promise to look for a better solution in case it happens again.

[RJ]

we know where this woman lives so buy flowers, chocolates etc and apologise for a poor solution to a parking overflow, and promise to look for a better solution in case it happens again.

Now that would be good PR!

[HOCOLITE]

PARKING:
Why the need for so many parking officials at some events. Surely drivers are able to park their own cars? We dont need marshalls to park at Tesco's!
(If there are areas to avoid / not allowed to park in a field these can be taped off), but we are all intelligent to be able to park a car ourselves.
The point is we are not we all want to park at the front we all want to avoid the cow pats thistles, puddles, bumps, mud patches etc. Also we often don't think about the car next to us-how often do orienteers sit in their car changing with the door open, stopping the person next to them getting in to theirs. I've often had to ask orieneers to shut their door so I can get in, I have been asked myself occassionally.And why is it often the case that some early arrivals are parked the furthest away?

The parking procedure is usually thought out to ease access and departure and to protect the field
No wonder many choose to park where they like.
And why the frequent rule of 'no vehicles will be allowed to leave the car park before 12.30'... I guess this is usually because of a narrow entry, and people may still be arriving... BUT you cannot physically stop anyone from leaving whenever they wish.

[b]This information is always published up front and is usually for the reason you suggest. Surely you understand that if we are using a farm access track we have to consider this carefully. An orienteer who needs to leave early should contact the organiser and make arrangements not just assume it will be OK for them to slip out. I fully support those trying to escape being held back until it is clear for them to leave, how would lost old timer feel if his early departure prevented an emergency vehicle coming in

You are behaving just like the lady said. Why can't I park where I like and leave when I want to. With this attitude I'd add selfish to the description.

[HOCOLITE]

Lost old timer I quote from you in another thread.'Either have the rules and keep them, or do away with them all.' Therefore if there is an instruction about departure time in the final details, that should be obeyed, it is an instruction not a rule but remember your school days you followed (or should have done) your teachers instructions just as you followed the school rules. Generally these instructions are there for a reason, by all means ask the organiser but don't assume they are put there to inconvenience you.

[King Penguin]

We dont need marshalls to park at Tesco's!

All Tesco's car parks I know have white lines painted on them to indicate the space for each vehicle. I've yet to find these on any parking field at an "O" event; hence marshalls.

[distracted]

Is it just me, or does LOT sound far more like a miserable grumpy old man than a 29 year old in all of his postings? Moaning about whether people are competitive (but seemingly not taking the matter further), the fact he can't park where he likes or get out of the field immediately after he's finished his run (obviously doesn't want to socialise with our types...), that rules must apply to everyone else but seemingly don't have to apply to him.... The list goes on.

Not really the attitude we want to put across, is it? A bit egotistic, to say the least...