Voiding races

[afterthought]

I could have included this in the Europeans topic I guess but I know the community includes folk who will have enlightening knowledge and comments.

So when something goes wrong with a course in Britain, such as dodgy mapping, a misplaced control, some code numbers falling off etc, the race is normally voided, I think. Is this a rule, or a custom, and is it the same in other countries?

Until today I had not thought about this: I accepted that was the way it was.

Today I read the European Middle Distance Finals will be open to anyone who ran the Qualifiers, because one of the six heats had a misplaced control (similar feature 30m away.) I suppose this could be influenced by a general feeling in the international community about the Portuguese organisation (e.g. the live results has not worked properly on any day of the three so far) but it does seem effectively voiding the whole thing is a huge reaction.

See http://www.eoc2014.fpo.pt/index.php/en/198-organizing-committee-statement-middle-distance

I note the Swiss team suggested living with the original results.

And I wonder if that might not be better?

Most of us probably supported runners doing the Sheffield half-marathon recently even though it was offically off when the water didn't turn up.

Maybe when despite the best efforts of the organisers something does go awry we should live with it. Of course it would not be good if this meant standards slipped at all, but would they?

By way of parallels with other sports that I read about in the media:
1. Formula 1 seems to do well from rule issues.
2. Football seems to thrive on incorrect referee decisions.

[DaveR]

So when something goes wrong with a course in Britain, such as dodgy mapping, a misplaced control, some code numbers falling off etc, the race is normally voided, I think.

Actually, what normally happens in Britain when there has been a significant problem is that there is much muttering in the car park.

Quite often someone has an unofficial word with one of the officials.

Very occasionally someone has an official word with one of the officials.

Very rarely indeed someone put in an official protest.

Extremely rarely is that protest acted on and a course voided.

I would argue that most races don't matter, so the full official protest route is not appropriate for these, low key races. Protests are appropriate for higher level events (My definition of higher level event would be JK, British Champs, Scottish Champs and above, but your definition may vary) but even here people are reluctant to put in an official protest. When a protest is submitted juries have limited options and are unsurprisingly reluctant to void the course.

[JK]

I wonder if the option of
* Other 2 heats qualifier qualify
* heat with problem, how about allowing anyone into the final in
a) top 17 as original results
b) top 17 after taking out the 2 controls in question

That would have let most of those into the final who had some merit for being there and only would have added on a small number of the stronger ones from that heat

Or were there some reasonable issues on the other courses too?

JK

[eddie]

JK middle race some years ago got voided. Mistakes happen life moves on.

[Big Jon]

I note the Swiss team suggested living with the original results.

The IOF event adviser was Swiss, so perhaps a conflict of interest between the adviser and the team?

[graeme]

I wonder if ...

Far too fair, and against section 24.15. Much better to let the organisers figure out how to do a start list with 220 people.

[DJM]

The IOF event adviser was Swiss, so perhaps a conflict of interest between the adviser and the team?

The IOF Adviser chairs the jury but is not a voting member ...

[Big Jon]

The IOF event adviser was Swiss, so perhaps a conflict of interest between the adviser and the team?

The IOF Adviser chairs the jury but is not a voting member ...

Aye, but the Swiss team might be leant on to preserve the Swiss authority.... after all the Swiss never make mistakes, especially buses at WMOC

[blairtrewin]

I seem to recall a reasonably shambolic World Cup race in that part of the world in 1996, too (in which the flash flood between the last control and the finish was merely the most visible of a long list of mishaps).

[Arnold]

I wonder how it got to this situation in the first place - it doesn't seem that the misplaced control was a freak event but rather that the whole thing is a bit shambolic.

For a European Champs that is quite surprising, especially as I thought the Portuguese had form in organising big events by now.

Plus the IOF event advisor is Swiss so stereotypically should be a paragon of precision and detail. He can't check all the controls, but you would expect him to notice that it's all a bit seat-of-the-pants and put in some remedial measures

I guess ultimately the IOF isn't exactly spoilt for choice with large event organisers (witness no initial offers for either WOC 2017 or WOC 2018 - although the former finally went to Estonia and the latter recently to Latvia). But still...

[graeme]

He can't check all the controls,

Whyever not? It was only a middle distance area, nothing more than a mile from assembly or 100m from a path. Should take a couple of hours to check the tags and then you could do a final check on the morning (unless you have some insanely long start list...). What else would he be doing?

[Red Adder]

JKs suggested solution seems to be the most sensible ones ever posited on Nopesport - I think his access needs revoking immediately.

[Arnold]

Well OK theoretically he could check all the controls, but in practice there are 7 races in 7 days so even someone as fit as you graeme would be fairly knackered by the end of it.

Anyway he's only the Event Advisor so it's not really his job to check all the control sites on the day. They have national controllers for that.

My point was more about the systemic issues (it seems the map quality was poor as well) which surely should have been picked up somewhere.

[graeme]

My point was more about the systemic issues (it seems the map quality was poor as well) which surely should have been picked up somewhere.

Fair point: since the controllers evidently can't be trusted with this, maybe IOF need to set up a Map Advisory Group