Running back through the start

[Glucosamine]

Should I not be running through the start if it seems a legitimate route (whether the best route I leave it to others to judge)? Having done this mid-course last year, I found myself at the weekend (not for the first time) in the heat of the moment choosing to run from the map boxes back through the start boxes to get to the first control. Lots of apologies as I tried not to play skittles with those still waiting to start - but I fear the air was probably blue behind me. Generally not such an issue if the path is wide enough or if room has been left for the public using the path - but can seem rather antisocial otherwise. Always a challenge for the planner, given all the necessary constraints, but are there (or should there be) implicit 'technical areas' at events which are effectively out-of-bounds?

[Red Adder]

I don't think its against the rules but I would suggest that if a sensible and realistic route choice is back through the start area then generally the planner has not done a particularly good job on designing the start and first leg. Of course sometimes constraints can be severe and its perhaps the least worst option, and of course some people make perverse decisions anyway.

[madmike]

what Red Adder said

[andypat]

An interesting example in the ESOC sprint prologue in Feb where the fastest route was back through the start (which apparently nobody took) and was considerably shortened by the placing of the pre-start some 50-60m shy of the start kite- quite a distance in a sprint race. So in order to gauge the shortest route you had to not only calculate the relevant distances of each route choice, you then had to take account of the location of the pre-start (which isnt on the map).

[ba-ba]

and was considerably shortened by the placing of the pre-start some 50-60m shy of the start kite- quite a distance in a sprint race.

ah yes, but technically you should visit the start kite and it should eally be taped to indicate this.
Am I correct in thinking this, and am I correct in thinking this has been debated on nope in the past...

[DavidJ]

"Rules: Appendix B: 4.1.4 The courses should be designed so that competitors are unlikely to return past the start on their way to the first control site."

[King Penguin]

At Delamere in early Jan I ran back through the start between control 1 and 2. Not quite the best route when I studied the map afterwards, but not far off. I think I have also done so mid-race somewhere before, but cannot remember where.
One time when it must definitely not be a sensible option is when proximity controls are in use.....

[Jayne]

discussion from a while ago http://forum.nopesport.com/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=6752&p=77346&hilit=visiting+start#p77346

[andypat]

and was considerably shortened by the placing of the pre-start some 50-60m shy of the start kite- quite a distance in a sprint race.

ah yes, but technically you should visit the start kite and it should eally be taped to indicate this.
Am I correct in thinking this, and am I correct in thinking this has been debated on nope in the past...

You sure about that? If os is it the competitors responsibility to visit it or the planners to make sure they have no option? I've definitely been told the opposite in my O career on more than one occasion.

[LostAgain]

and was considerably shortened by the placing of the pre-start some 50-60m shy of the start kite- quite a distance in a sprint race.

ah yes, but technically you should visit the start kite and it should eally be taped to indicate this.
Am I correct in thinking this, and am I correct in thinking this has been debated on nope in the past...

You sure about that? If os is it the competitors responsibility to visit it or the planners to make sure they have no option? I've definitely been told the opposite in my O career on more than one occasion.

If so then you would have to either put the start punch on the start kite or have a punch on it, otherwise not realistic to enforce.

If the route to the 1st control has a reasonable route through the start boxes then I think it would be an oversight by the Planner/Controller.

[Gross]

Check Appendix B 4.1.4 of the rules.

Doesn't say you can't go back through the start.
I'm sure it used to say you had to visit the start control... but can't see anything (easily) that says that now

[AndyC]

I have in the past as planner asked the start team to remind competitors that it is a requirement to visit the start flag (start was in a nice flat area, start flag was on the top of a dune in front which most courses logically went past).
I have also found myself runnng through the start again, 3 times come to mind; once I made a 180 (who hasn't) at the start (as I was doing an "easy" I course lent my compass to someone who'd forgotten his ...) , once on an MLN course my first control was actually behind me as I stood on the start line - flag a few feet in front (confused me for a moment but you should have seen the squaddies ploughing straight on in the wrong direction! very effective test at their level.), and I also remember an urban event where the area was in two parts linked by open land (with multiple paths) in which the start was placed- I chose to run past the start because that way I knew which of the paths (which might not for obvious reasons be perfectly mapped) I was actually on - worth the risk of a slight delay getting past other competitors.

[charles2]

Yes I noticed that on that blue course a good route to the first control was back through the start and past the finish. But many would have started off down a track and look at their maps and then decide not to go back through the start.
On my course a route to the finish was through the start area, but by the time I was finishing the start area was being cleared away.
Good planning can avoid these potential problems, but it is not always possible.

[Arnold]

Never mind the rules (which you can't enforce anyway) but good planning should i) ensure you go past the start kite and ii) ensure there is no sensible route choice straight back through the start

The only possible exception may be that later in the course, there could be a (really long) route choice where running through the start is one of the options. It's not ideal, but sometimes hard to avoid if you want a great long route choice and a decent start location on a smallish area. But it shouldn't be too much of a problem as runners will plan ahead, as opposed to turning around on the spot to barge past all the boxes again

[andypat]

I do remember an event a few years back where there was a route choice through the car park while it was still filling up - not so good for safety...