Is traditional orienteering dying?

[graeme]

An interesting thing about Sean's article is that the featured athletes do not seem to have tried, or be interested in trying, athletics' core olympic discipline of Track and Field. It seems they are more than happy to pour money into polevaulting because there are lots of joggers out there. And nobody is even trying to get the joggers into sprinting.

So when we worry about...

how to set up our events and activities to encourage newcomers to move from these to TD5.

maybe we're asking the wrong question.

[bewildered]

If we want orienteering to survive, then we need people to take on organising the events. Most of those are getting old, so we need replacements to come in from somewhere.

SportEngland are probably not supporting the Pole Vaulters, they are probably funded by UKSport, as that is an Olympic sport - interesting - as opposed to Orienteering, not an Olympic sport - complete waste of time (as far as UKSport is concerned).

I would like my daughter to have the same chances to get scratched and muddy in a complex forest as I did/have - or to be able to do great Urban events - or to do park sprints. And I would like her to be able to do this when I am too old to be capable of putting on events - which may not be too long!

[SeanC]

Part of the problem IMHO is the mindset of many orienteers.. that orienteering is not a variant of running. Really that journalist should be able to add an 11th runner type, "the orienteer", but some of us think we and our sport are different/better etc than runners, and that when runners turn up we should try and convert them to become 'proper' orienteers. I don't see why.. offer runners non-technical orienteering that they'll enjoy*, be competitive in and come back for, no pressure to learn how to do TD3/4/5. We should be part of the running community, not separate.

Make them feel welcome enough for long enough and some might even organise a few events.

* as well as, not instead of

[Sunlit Forres]

Of the 109 runners at Moravian's Level D traditional event this morning, 33 were unattached. The rest (apart from 4 from other O clubs) were Moravian members. Why are all these unattached folk coming to orienteering events if orienteering's dying? Something doesn't make sense.

[AndyC]

Of the 109 runners at Moravian's Level D traditional event this morning, 33 were unattached. The rest (apart from 4 from other O clubs) were Moravian members. Why are all these unattached folk coming to orienteering events if orienteering's dying? Something doesn't make sense.

Presumably because you're doing something right up there - time to bottle it and send it Southward

[greywolf]

at Moravian's Level D traditional event this morning...

but in many respects not a "traditional" event:
Two courses (4k TD4 19c + 2k TD2) not seven (so lots more competition across age groups etc) on a 1:5000 map updated for the event
Saturday morning not Sunday, with a short start window
Registration/download indoors, with toilets, and coffee/tea/juice & biscuits available
And most critically following lots of promotional and development work especially in Primary schools

Definitely a good turnout - although only one M/W 18/20/21 - and no doubt a model that could work elsewhere

[Paul Frost]

Presumably because you're doing something right up there - time to bottle it and send it Southward

Well obviously not everything, why aren't they joining the club?
Playing devils advocate, or doesn't that matter?

[greywolf]

why aren't they joining the club?

give 'em a chance - almost all were M/W 10, a fair few at their first event

[Paul Frost]

And possibly their last, if their parents don't get involved as well.

But each club has to decide what's important to them and their survival/growth, and it will be different for each club.

[SeanC]

I picked up a copy of "Trail Running" the other day. It had an interesting article by RIchard Askwith (author of Fell Running book "Feet In The Clouds") about the rise in popularity of fell, trail and adventure running in the past few years. I couldn't help thinking how orienteering has completely missed out on this boom as I read this section:

There has been a secondary boom in trail, adventure and obstacle racing and other forms of running that ask more from competitors than putting one food in front of the other on a flat surface. According to Jim Mee, the York-based entrepreneur behind Rat Race, Britain's best known adventure and obstacle race brand "We had 300 for our first event in 2004. This year we've got 21 events with 70,000 entrants". Those events range form simple 5k forest trails to a trathlon up Ben Nevis with assault courses in between. But they're all "deliberately mass market" requiring neither elite fitness nor survival skills. If you've got the money and you're willing to suffer, you're welcome!

You can see where (with exceptions) orienteering has gone wrong in recent years. It's too niche. The standard colour coded course for adults (light green upwards) requires if not always elite navigation skills, at least advanced navigation skills. We've missed out on the market of people who just want to turn up and enjoy themselves without having to acquire special skills. Publicity and other factors are important too I'm sure. Ironic really as we freely use the term "sport for all" to describe ourselves, and also we're told that our marketing needs to be more targetted.

[Sunlit Forres]

but in many respects not a "traditional" event:

which is propbably a fair point. Despite the local popularity of Moravian's Saturday & Schools Series, hardly any established orienteers come from other clubs. It would appear this format is best suited to local competition, but I can't see why it has to be so. The maps are good, the areas excellent, the organisation first class and the the sociability top notch.

Paul - I will report back in a few days' time on whether any of these "unattacheds" join up. I'm quite interested in that myself. Since 1st Jan MOR have had 5 new adult members and 3 new juniors joining.

[EddieH]

SeanC, for someone who keeps suggesting innovative ideas, you do state so much negative stuff about our wonderful sport.

Moravian never shy away from the word ORIENTEERING, and there is a tendency towards having courses a wee bit more technical than the guidelines. It is clear from Tough Mudder and suchlke that people lke to feel challenged, and that is what we make them feel.

The vast majority of the population have a phobia about maps and orienteering will never appeal to them - I don't want my sport dummed down to attract them (that's probably where "Sport for all" is wrong, and we are wasting our time trying to get them in).

There are however still hundreds of thousands of people that could be attracted to the sport and these are who we want to get out message to.

What I am learning from Sunlits's initiative is that it really is possible to grab primary school pupils at an age when they are open to possibilities. Get enough of them in an area and they appear to be not just self sustaining, but positively evangelical as they grow into their hormonal years.

It is clear that both MAROC and MOR are achieving this helped in no small part by the fact we have fabulous terrain to maintain the interest as standards improve. I am certain that if we simply sat on nearly 100% TD3 maximum, many of our, and particularly MAROC's stars (MAROC have been doing this for several years longer than we have,) would have left the sport from boredom.

[Paul Frost]

...hardly any established orienteers come from other clubs. It would appear this format is best suited to local competition, but I can't see why it has to be so. The maps are good, the areas excellent, the organisation first class and the the sociability top notch.

As an established orienter from another localish club I didn't think it was worth the drive to run a short TD4 course. But I know these events are very popular with the locals, especially juniors.
By contrast BASOC have been putting on small events using good quality areas, including proper TD5 difficulty, no luxury facilities etc. and we have been getting lots of established orienteers from other clubs. BASOC has almost no juniors, but several adult beginners. Event locations are nearly always remote and require a car (and time) to get there. So juniors are likely to be accompanied by parents who are active as well.

Orienteering is a niche sport, not a mass participation event. People need to learn skills to take part and a lot of people don't want to learn skills, they just want an experience.

The trick for clubs is finding a model that works for them and satisfies the volunteers that make it all happen, and not just the potential participants.

[SeanC]

Apologies if I sounded negative. I just needed to go orienteering. Ash ridge was lovely today. Thanks HH.

sometime this week I'll try and post a picture of a course perfect for trail runners that requires no navigation skill but has some of the elements of orienteering that we enjoy. the idea is that it is a money generator to help pay for and preserve classic, technical orienteering.

[Gross]

requires no navigation skill but has some of the elements of orienteering that we enjoy. t.

Orienteering is about navigation.