Rome 2013

[madmike]

Curious as to why the Rome orienteering should have requirements that are so much more onerous.

because the paranoid android who asked the formal question of the authorities and got the new legal wordin from themg, which is related to the prosecution of a whole loads of Doctors here for falsely signing medical certificates for whiplash. More experienced and pragmatic people would never have written to ask Doctors and Lawyers for advice like say Venice, WMOC, MOC Venice marathon....

Can you please email your difficulties in convincing doctors to sign to the info email as I want to bang someone on the nose with it and your evidence will help.

[EddieH]

BigJon beat me to it.

Invent a practice and a doctor, and sign it. The forms are only for filing away. No-one is going to check to see if the practice is real let alone the doctor.

[madmike]

BigJon beat me to it.

Invent a practice and a doctor, and sign it. The forms are only for filing away. No-one is going to check to see if the practice is real let alone the doctor.

could not possibly comment having checked several hundred at WMOC

[King Penguin]

The British contingent is about 14% of total entries. That's a big hole if a significant number are not able to get the requisite doctor's approval, as well as some very disappointed would-be participants. Immediate reaction from our doctor's is "doubtful"; should have a more definite response tomorrow.

[nooomember]

BigJon beat me to it.

Invent a practice and a doctor, and sign it. The forms are only for filing away. No-one is going to check to see if the practice is real let alone the doctor.

I think you will find that is serious Fraud.
You are also committing an offence inciting fraud.

[AndyC]

There is an incitement to deception but "In criminal law, fraud is intentional deception made for personal gain or to damage another individual;" it is difficult to see that there is much personal gain involved and I can't see who would be harmed?
(quote is from wikipeda btb)
There is probably an offence of misrepresentation involved but I suspect there isn't an expert on Italian law here (madmike?)

[Big Jon]

BigJon beat me to it.

Invent a practice and a doctor, and sign it. The forms are only for filing away. No-one is going to check to see if the practice is real let alone the doctor.

I think you will find that is serious Fraud.
You are also committing an offence inciting fraud.

Go on then report me/us to authorities (UK, Italy???) and see what happens. The whole issue of medical forms is a complete farce and should be treated as such.

[Happy]

Finding similar problems with our Doctor. I keep missing calls from his secretary whose voicemail message is that he has an issue with the wording of the form - there would seem to be concerns with its present format and I get the feeling a reluctance to get involved.

The cost quoted is £107.

[andypat]

How are the guys who are going to WOC 2014 going to manage? Do they get special dispensation? This whole shenanigans certainly would dampen my enthusiasm to go to the spectator races.

[Mrs H]

I haven't heard from my doctor yet and its been nearly a week since i dropped the forms in - not a good sign perhaps as we will not be able to afford £150 each.

A couple of thoughts occurs to me.

Firstly: Why have the Italian authorities gone down the medical path for amateur sport at all? surely a proper legally binding form along the lines that the participant takes responsibility for themselves and signed for by themselves would get the organisers off the hook. Why bring the doctors in?

Secondly: Look at this statement

they will not be permitted to start and will not be included in the official results, but they will be given their maps and their race bags (if requested upon entering in the competition): this means that they can still visit the courses, like in a training, after the competition is over, at their very own risk and responsibility.

Does that mean if all else fails we could turn up and run the course afterwards while the controls are still out? All we would then need is some Brit to turn up with a download station and we can have a race time to compare with each other and the official competitors.

[NeilC]

Whilst waiting for my doctor to get back to me I have also been going through various scenarios. One of which does involve taking over a master station and laptop for some DIY results (or taking 3 dibbers each and downloading when we got home). If enough Brits don't manage to get their certificates (and don't wish to forge them) I'm sure we can run our own separate event somehow.

[Mrs H]

OOOh great minds think alike Neil - but you've got the know how! Can I be at your event please?

[graeme]

In my experience...

Some countries have sensible rules, which people abide by. This is good.
Other countries have stupid rules which people ignore. Less good, but manageable.

The real problem is when people from one type of country are faced with the rules in the second type of country.

[Spookster]

The real problem is when people from one type of country are faced with the rules in the second type of country.

I don't think it's a problem for all of the people from one type of country, just some of them.

There have been 11 pages of posts mainly about medical certificates now. I really hope the event is so amazing, the terrain so stunning and the courses so brilliant that we spend as long congratulating the organisers and planners afterwards!

[Jayne]

I think the problem is that someone in the country in question tried asked too much about the rules and then tried to comply with them.