beoc should be mandatory

[harry]

I think it's just the Swedes and the Norweigens who have the rule.

In response to Jez's comment.

Elites competing elsewhere are essentially hiding and pretending you are better than you really are!

I'm sure you didn't mean me specifically but I still feel the need to defend myself. Think I explained myself above but travel to BEOC would have been over 4 times the price of the train down to Denmark and not as relevant preparation for the upcoming World Studs. Nick B and Jamie obviously wanted to do the official EM test races ahead of EM next month. But then you can't really accuse Jamie of pretending to be better than he is.

[Ed]

Why not hold BEOC after the Scandi champs then - surely that gets around the rule and would mean that Jamie, Dan, Helen (*2) etc... could all run in both!

Scandi champs are usually in September, I'm not sure BEOC should therefore be October every year!... apart from which I'm sure the Scandis would still stop them running both competitively anyway.

[the duncan]

if you are british then you should surely run in the British Champs, isn't that the race everyone wants to win?

There are a lot of other top races on the continent that people can do, everyone ought to make the effort, especially those in the squad, as how else will evryone measure themselves against the top people.

[Ed]

if you are british then you should surely run in the British Champs, isn't that the race everyone wants to win?

seemingly not - or at least not enough that they're prepared to pay to get there and maybe forego other things.

[Jon X]

(before BEOC)

well good luck to all who venture north this weekend, i'll be throwing myself round glentress on a bike.

(after BEOC)

if you are british then you should surely run in the British Champs

I prefer your second option! You might have some perfectly good reason why you weren't there, I don't know. BUT as well as getting all the British team/squad to BEOC, we should want it to be the top race of the year, and it is a far better race if it is basically the top 60 in the country rather than the only 60 who bother to enter.

I quite enjoyed my lengthy and mistake-ridden run round Lossie on Sunday - but I quite accept it would have been a much better race if the standard of entry was such that there was a need for selection to be applied, and that hence I had not been able to get onto the course. This would only have taken (say) 60 of the top 100 in the country to turn up - is that really too much to ask for a British Elite Champs?

[the duncan]

my reason for not being there.

my legs don't work. i can run for about 30 minutes then thats about it.

as for on a bike, for some reason my legs are fine.

and i had decided a few weeks ago that i wasn't going to get anywhere in my orienteering this year, other than peeved off at how pants i was running, so i'm chilling out from O for a bit, maybe come back next year,

but don't get me wrong, i'd love to win BEOC, its a great feeling to be able to say that you are british champ, done it as a junior, want to do it as a senior

[Becks]

This would only have taken (say) 60 of the top 100 in the country to turn up - is that really too much to ask for a British Elite Champs?

To be fair - on a random weekend mid term time with flights costing twice our weekly budgets - yeah, it is too much to ask really.

[bendover]

as has been discussed many times on this forum, the placement of races within the fixtures calender is ALWAYS going to suit some people and not others. 'Placing' BEOC is almost always going to be a problem for students, especially if it is in the may/june timescale. i guess if you make sure that it isn't a selection race for World Students teams then at least that takes away some of the pressure...?

i reckon this years race was at a good time of the year. the weather was hot enough to make it a challenge (but not an ordeal), and even if it had rained there was never going to be an all consuming maelstrom, so spectating wasn't really going to be affected. however the fact remains that not all of the main contenders were there, so obviously an extra incentive was needed - so therefore i agree with Jon, it should have been a selection race. Making it compulsory? perhaps a bit too far, but something should be done to resurrect the "British Champion" title as something to aspire too EVERY year. If this means looking at fixtures more carefully both at home and abroad, and even consulting with elite athletes (via an annual poll on this website perhaps?) then so be it.

Personally i'd love to see all the elite guys turning up at BEOC, even if it would almost certainly be to the detriment of my own placing!

[Numbskull]

if its going to be the uk cup final as well (i dunno if the uk cup works like the fcc) then it will be hard to fit the uk cup in before next years at the british which will be in april - but i'm sure they'll manage it

[Ed]

if its going to be the uk cup final as well (i dunno if the uk cup works like the fcc) then it will be hard to fit the uk cup in before next years at the british which will be in april - but i'm sure they'll manage it

the uk cup doesn't work the same as the fcc. there is no such thing as the uk cup final - it is just a series of races. there is no reason for beoc to be the last race of the series - in fact, it's not always been in the past ('99 the last race was the JOK sprint)

[Jon X]

How about automatically pre-selecting the British Champion for WOC each year? That might encourage elites to turn up and would place suitable value on being national champion.

Not sure if I am suggesting doing this for all of sprint, medium and classic, but would like to see it for classic!

[mharky]

i ran in the British M20E champs but non-competatively... what does that count as???

I am running SM because its a bigger challenge.

How about automatically pre-selecting the British Champion for WOC each year?

Was last years BEOC Classic champion at WOC?

I think having it as a selection race is enough.

[Ed]

Was last years BEOC Classic champion at WOC?

no - but if the whole british WOC team had been at BEOC last year would last years BEOC classic champion have been last years BEOC classic champion?

or this year for that matter? only one of the european champs mens team was at BEOC, and only three of the world students team.

and no, I'm not offended if anyone answers 'no' - I don't think I should have been in the WOC team last year (or at least, certainly not for the classic, or any of the other races given my selection race results), and I don't think I've got any more claim to be in the team than lots of other people this year - that's what the WOC special selection races are for.

If BEOC was a selection race then the winner probably would be selected anyway without needing any extra thing about the winner automatically being in the team, but when it's not a selection race it's just another 'all known form' which the selectors can look at or ignore as they choose...

[Jon X]

i ran in the British M20E champs but non-competatively... what does that count as???

I don't know, but personally I don't think it should be allowed - where does it leave the British Championships if the fastest person on the day is British and running non-competitively. My view is that it just makes the race look stupid if the British title does not go to the fastest Brit on the course - makes it look like we don't take our own national championship seriously.

[mharky]

no, it just makes it look like i dont take a national championship seriously, and i didn't.

I was there to qualify for JWOC.

I think the map made the race look stupid.

All I want to to get to the best i can. Running SM can help me do this, technical terrain, dealing with pressure of knowing that there is a world class field. This is good race practice. Being given a trophy and not being able to run SM wouldn't have benefited me