Horses for courses

[andypat]

Reading Pasi Ikonen's training summary on World of O

http://www.vaajakoskentera.com/ikonen/en/node/444

I wondered if the BOF selection process for WOCs takes account of the different styles of training that top athletes seem to adopt depending on what format they are targetting?

Pasi seems to be planning already for a middle distance campaign with the type of training he is doing (different than if he was planning on targetting the long). having following the UK selections for WOC over the past couple of years I got the impression that there wasnt maybe that consistency of approach here?

Obviously my knowledge is limited to what is published, but for 2010 I got the impression that the middle distance races were maybe considered less prestigious and the long selections went to the best orienteers. This year, long seemed to be almost discounted and the best orienteers targetted sprint.

I guess what I am trying to say is I wonder at what point in the process that decisions were made about what events are to be targetted and by who, as it seems that top orienteers are making this decision around now.

This isnt a question about selections or selectors, more a query about forward planning?

Incidentally Rocky (our self confessed sprint specialist) has just run a blinder on the snowdonia marathon so no idea what his plans are

[Big Jon]

It is far better to commit to a particular discipline and focus on it than to spread the effort round over all disciplines. How many 400m runners at Olympics also train for 5km? By aiming for all races competitors put themselves at the risk of not achieving at any.

[AndyC]

Distracting from the point (and I agree with Big Jon) I was talking at lunchtime to a non-orienteer who asked if she could compete on her horse.
And then I see this thread title!

[andypat]

By aiming for all races competitors put themselves at the risk of not achieving at any.

In your experience how much choice do the competitors get in the process?

I'm assuming that Scott and GG (with respect to the 3 guys who did long at the 2011WOC) hadnt spent the whole year actually training for the long?

[Scott]

a non-orienteer who asked if she could compete on her horse.

She could in America.

[Mrs H]

Orienteering on horseback is part of a popular multi skill riding sport called TREC. A firend of mine says there's quite a lot of it about.

[Big Jon]

In your experience how much choice do the competitors get in the process?

I'm not quite sure of the precise meaning of the question, but in my time (long, long time ago) there wasn't the sprint and the middle (or short as originally titled) was relatively new. So I never really had to make much decision with regard to training. Now the sprint racing has developed so I see it almost as a separate variation of orienteering - there are some guys who are superb at it but not really anywhere with regard to forest orienteering. Conversely there are many great forest orienteers who don't quite get absolute top level results in sprint. I'm sure this is down to emphasis in training - the demands of forest orienteering and urban sprint are very different.
The differences between middle and long are less pronounced - particularly in areas such as WOC 2011. Next year I believe that the long race is likely to be fairly boring terrain - possibly more of a MTBO on foot with lots of big route choices and then run like hell. If this is what IOF are trying to nudge long races towards then there may well be a split between middle and long with middle being intricate highly technical with short legs and long being big route choices and generally lower technical challenge.

Competitors get the chance to aim for one or more disciplines and then race the specific selection races. Wining one selection race at one discipline that has been committed to months previously is likely to lead to selection for WOC at that discipline. Alternatively they can avoid specialisation and race all 3 selection races. So to a certain extent they can choose what they will be selected for.

[Eric]

not sure these three have any issues about specialising

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simone_Niggli-Luder

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daniel_Hubmann

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thierry_Gueorgiou

[andypat]

Even gods like Tero might want to practice relay races....

[Eric]

Even gods like Tero might want to practice relay races....

bit harsh. he is the current champ and should have won a couple more.

[Big Jon]

Yes but Thierry has not, to my knowledge, ever done 3 individual disciplines at WOC... even for a god like him it makes sense to specialise in 1 or 2 disciplines and focus on them, thus improving his chances at securing another gold medal.

[haloite]

If we (BOF) were serious about "MP3" surely there would be specific squads - i.e. a Sprint Squad, a Middle Distance Squad - there wouldn't be a "Long Distance Squad" we are just not good enough / lack sufficient home terrain / enough regular opportunities for Elites to "race" "proper" Classic Distance Races(?).
Oooops - we don't really take "Middle Distance" seriously enough - although we do have bags of FANTASTIC terrain for the discipline - Lakes, Scotland, (the better bits) of Wales.
Oooops (2) - we don't really take "Sprint" seriously enough - again, we have MOUNTAINS (not literally) of EXCELLENT Sprint terrain - the vast majority yet still to be discovered / mapped no doubt!

Ducks for cover awaiting the inevitable Nopesport Forum Regulars wrath!

[Big Jon]

I'm not sure different squads are the answer - we haven't enough money or resources, what can be done is to encourage athletes to make a decision and help to plan a season of training aimed at the target.
One squad can do lots of good basic technical training together and even have head to head race training over all disciplines but each athlete should know what they are aiming for and tailor their personal training to that end. Remember that official squad training camps are only a tiny part of the whole training load over a year, most technical training has to come from the athlete themselves at their home with mates etc.

[Scott]

Oooops - we don't really take "Middle Distance" seriously enough - although we do have bags of FANTASTIC terrain for the discipline - Lakes, Scotland, (the better bits) of Wales.
Oooops (2) - we don't really take "Sprint" seriously enough - again, we have MOUNTAINS (not literally) of EXCELLENT Sprint terrain - the vast majority yet still to be discovered / mapped no doubt!

Ducks for cover awaiting the inevitable Nopesport Forum Regulars wrath!

If by "take seriously" you mean "have some sprint/middle races outside of the JK and British Champs", I reckon there are a fair few Nopesport forum regulars who would agree with you.

To be fair, the situation has improved a bit for middle races over the last year or so, and more clubs are starting to put them on, but the number of "proper" sprint (as opposed to 40+min urban) races remains pitifully small, probably because clubs remain (not unreasonably) worried that people won't travel for a short race, or even for two short races back-to-back.

[AndyO]

Oooops - we don't really take "Middle Distance" seriously enough - although we do have bags of FANTASTIC terrain for the discipline - Lakes, Scotland, (the better bits) of Wales.

Get this in your diary for next year

bigjon wrote:

Scottish Champs 2012 has just confirmed significant support from the Cairngorm National Park Authority and the CNPA Local Area Group (Leader funding. This will be used to ensure the maps are top class and that no expense is spared in hosting a top class event - remember 5 races in 4 days.... and all in lovely runnable (or cyclable for the MTBO) areas.
dates 2-5 June 2012, location Braemar and Deeside.

Glen Feardar - plus extension (Saturday 2nd June Scottish Individual Champs)
http://www.maroc.routegadget.co.uk/cgi- ... =47&kieli=
Creag Choinnich (Sunday 3rd June Scottish Relay Champs)
http://www.maroc.routegadget.co.uk/cgi- ... =66&kieli=
Inchmarnoch (Tuesday 5th June Middle distance race)
http://www.maroc.routegadget.co.uk/cgi- ... =39&kieli=

Best thread for a while, cheers, andypat