British Sprint and middle closing date

[LostAgain]

Just looking at the entry numbers for the 2011 Sprints:

454 men and 274 women = 828 overall

In 2010, there were 378 starters at the British Elite Sprint Champs and 270 at the British Sprint Champs, or 648 in all.

Given that some last year ran at both events and are therefore counted twice in the 648 figure, does the 828 entry for 2011 represent a big vote of confidence in favour of the new format of the event?

Other than your erroneous maths. The Sprint is a selection race for the juniors, which brings extra juniors and their taxi driver parents.

It also is a Master Cup race and combined with the Middle Distance event that cannot easily done in 1 day, not for us anyway.

I'd be very cautious about making an assumption that the format is more popular.

[LostAgain]

Start lists now up
https://www.sientries.co.uk/list.php?event_id=479

I'm surprised to see that in some instances n the Birtish Middle there is only a 1 minute start interval between people on the same course. In at least one instance two people from the same club are starting 1 minute apart:

M45L Mark Adams HH goes at 11:22 with his club mate Adam Leaf HH at 11:23
There is another bunch of 1 minute start intervals at 11:30 - 11:33

I thought at the British Championships we would have 4 minute intervals between club mates and a minimum of 2 minutes between others.

There are only 56 on the course and 180 minutes of start times, 3 minutes seems possible.

[NeilC]

There are only 56 on the course and 180 minutes of start times, 3 minutes seems possible.

112 starters at the last count.

It's an individual championship why does club matter?

The seeded runners are kept 2 minutes apart.

[Gnitworp]

It's an individual championship why does club matter?

I agree, it's an irrelevance. The people I know best are my contemporaries that irritatingly keep beating me and they're from all sorts of different clubs.

[LostAgain]

56 on M45L as far as I can see for the British M45L Middle Distance Championship.

Has rule:
4.2.4 Each heat should have runners starting in the reverse order of their rankings positions so that the best ranked in each heat starts last.[/i]

Been applied for the British Age Class Sprint?
I guess not as Dave Rollins is significantly higher ranked than me but starts earlier.

I was expecting a donkey like me to be near the front and have a train of people running through me

[JamieP]

56 on M45L as far as I can see for the British M45L Middle Distance Championship.

And another 56 on M50 which, according to the final details, also runs course 4.

[awk]

does the 828 entry for 2011 represent a big vote of confidence in favour of the new format of the event?

Our own example should indicate that no way can you draw this conclusion. All three of our family are entered, two of us in age classes, but none of us are happy with the new format. We are going because it's the British Champs, because of UK Masters etc.. We are NOT going because we like the new format. Indeed, the new format is so off-putting, we hesitated quite a long time before entering, in spite of the fact that we all love sprints; we would not have hesitated with the old format, and it was only because it is a UK Masters weekend that we are going. Two of us attended the Nottingham University sprints, and reckon that event will be hard pushed to be bettered by the British Sprints, not least because it adopted the old British elite format of a competition for men and a competition for women full stop.

All sorts of aspects of it make it a big step backwards from the Elite sprints to date. Two of us see the qualifiers now as significantly less interesting, with all but the Elite getting only 2 finals. Thus, barring miracles/major accidents, finals for these two are boringly predictable - the complete antithesis of what sprinting is all about. All of us will miss the fact that the previous sprints was based on your ability whatever your age, and that the finals were so mixed and varied in composition. None of us see being mixed in with solely the same people we run against week in week out as at all an advantage. The efforts of the working party to 'group' classes together to create interest looks as if it pretty much came to nought in terms of adding interest.

No disrespect to the organisers - the event promises much because of their efforts, but that will be in spite of, not because of, the new format.

[NeilC]

I guess not as Dave Rollins is significantly higher ranked than me but starts earlier.

Some parents request split times.

Anything else?

[Paulo]

Mens Elite - I can see there will be 18 in the A final (top 6 in each heat). But what is the cut-off point to qualify for the B final? - earlier comments suggest it's not just a 50/50 split between B and C finals and that the majority should make the B final...

[roadrunner]

... all but the Elite getting only 2 finals.

Surely the one place where the new format really falls apart is (for the entries this year) M/W10, where there's only an A final. So these competitors have to complete their heat successfully to be competitive in the final, but the time is irrelevant. In fact, there might actually be an advantage in being slow, because then they would be able to chase the slower competitors starting after them

[greywolf]

W35 looks odd, where 10 are competing for 6 final places, but the heat split is 4 - 2 - 4, so in one heat they only have to finish, in the other 2 heats they have to be in the top half...

[NeilC]

Mens Elite - I can see there will be 18 in the A final (top 6 in each heat). But what is the cut-off point to qualify for the B final? - earlier comments suggest it's not just a 50/50 split between B and C finals and that the majority should make the B final...

The next 75 qualify for the B final. Only the MElite class are likely to have a C-final.

[NeilC]

or W35, where 10 are competing for 6 final places, but the heat split is 4 - 2 - 4, so in one heat they only have to finish, in the other 2 heats they have to be in the top half

A transcription error, now corrected:

Amanda Barlow SLOW 11:05 2C
Angela Darley GO 11:13 2C
Sacha Fisher SMOC 12:05 2C
Catherine Galvin LOK 12:03 2A
Alison Hooper SO 11:03 2A
Carol Lovegrove SN 12:08 2B
Carys Morgan SLOW 11:57 2C
Helen Pearce HH 11:43 2A
Pauline Sinclair TVOC 11:53 2B
Anne Straube OD 11:05 2B


Jon, could you go through the rest of the age classes and let me know if any of the others are imbalanced.

[greywolf]

only noticed W35 because they are running the same course...

[Tessa]

I think we may have this discussion each year and I can't remember the outcome - but aren't the heat allocations meant to be kept secret?

EDIT: just been told apparently "there is no compulsion to keep the heat allocation secret"
ignore me then.