JK Bicton

[Wendles]

Some photos here http://www.flickr.com/photos/wendles56/sets/72157623757103822/

[HOCOLITE]

Wendles. Looks like you captured young Neville in his dancing mode. Good job it was day time or he wouldn't have had a shirt on

[HOCOLITE]

Sorry to raise this again but I've just been looking at route gadget and it seems that a large number of people crossed a fence marked as uncrossable. That is unless I don't understand the symbols. I thought double tag meant uncrossable and therefore the fence on either side of the road west of the start should not be crossed.
I found it interesting to see the options taken on various courses to control 59, it seems that all the routes I thought of were taken and there seems to be an even split on most courses.

[paul]

Sorry to raise this again but I've just been looking at route gadget and it seems that a large number of people crossed a fence marked as uncrossable. That is unless I don't understand the symbols. I thought double tag meant uncrossable and therefore the fence on either side of the road west of the start should not be crossed.
I found it interesting to see the options taken on various courses to control 59, it seems that all the routes I thought of were taken and there seems to be an even split on most courses.

There is a stile marked on the southern fence along the road west of the start - pretty much directly on the line between controls 1 and 2 on course 8. Is that where you mean?

[ba-ba]

I thought that may have been what was meant, but when you look at the RG traces there's some hardcore fence-jumping been going on!

[Paul Frost]

I do recommend when uploading an event into RouteGadget that the purple bits are included in the map image, see this article for how to do it.

[EddieH]

Interesting. Had I spotted the style mapped I would stil not have been clear that I could have legitimately used it as it involves crossing a solid thick black line.

I have looked up the iOF ISSOM specifications and there is no mention of such a symbol there - the only crossing point symbol is the standard one with a gap. I think this was the wrong symbol to use and creates ambiguity.

The gap symbol means crossing point - nowhere does it say it has to be a gate.

I have ittle doubt that the symbol was supposed to represent a crossable style, but seeing it in competition I certainly would not have used it.

[distracted]

There were a couple of times I saw/crossed a stile on the ground, but didn't immediately see it on the map, which suggests they weren't overly obvious... I didn't realise at the time that they shouldn't have been used.

The point of using the sprint specification is readability - it makes it obvious on a glance at the map what you can cross, and where you can cross it. This is why you have the thick black uncrossable fences/walls, it's also why all ways through/across them should be made obvious too. Ideally this should be using the gate/a gap, but if it still isn't very clear you can always overprint the crossing point symbol to confirm that it is a valid route.

Other than that, I think the planners did pretty well in creating interesting courses with the limited area that they had and should be applauded!

[King Penguin]

Just after control 6 on M16/M50 there was an overprinted red crossing point on the competition map which does not appear on Routegadget. Everyone on the course will appear to have crossed an uncrossable fence in RG when it was in fact perfectly legitimate.
(north side of all the fenced fields).

[DavidJ]

There is a stile marked on the southern fence along the road west of the start - pretty much directly on the line between controls 1 and 2 on course 8. Is that where you mean?

There are a few of these on the map. There is another at the exit from the field which we all used to get to the start (just next to where the numbers were). I remember this as a gate though. It does appear to be a non-standard symbol.

I though have a different question relating to the use of the white (run) around prominent trees. This was obvious in the large park areas but I found it confusing on the campus. I can't see a reference to this in the ISSOM spec so was wondering if people think that this was the right thing to do.

[redkite]

david
Having just started to map parts of the centre of Cardiff. As a total novice to mapping the biggest dilema so far is how map the trees and not cause confusion. I tend to agree with you that in the parks put the white round the trees, use the open forest symbol.

More of an issue is once you move to the streets, car parks etc. On the assumption that you need to show trees, (or do you?) how do you depict rows of trees at the side of street? does it make a difference if the trees are in a strip (200 yards +) of grass at side of road as opposed to embedd in the concrete car park? Do not have an answer yet but there is a big danger that you overcomplicate a map when it is not necessary.

Any experienced mappers put there?

[distracted]

I came across this website a while ago and think it offers very good advice, and I try to follow these conventions in the urban maps that I've made:

http://www.soenniksen.dk/sprintkort/gb.htm

The "trees and bushes" and "wood or park?" pages are probably what you're after.

And opinions will also vary depending on whether it's summer or winter... mapping is an art rather than a science.

[Wayward-O]

I have looked up the iOF ISSOM specifications and there is no mention of such a symbol there ...

BOF Appendix H:Mapping 1.2.3 specifies:

Symbol 526.1: Stile - a crossing point over a wall or fence suitable only for foot passage is represented by a black line 0.18mm wide and 0.5mm long.

As this Appendix is dated July 2002, pre-dating the IOF ISSOM sprint mapping standard, I'm unsure that it is applicable to it.

[EddieH]

Maybe Wayward-O but does this refer to ISSOM maps? Damn silly if it does - this is an international event where solid black lines mean FORBIDDEN. Local rules make no sense.

[katy]

Looking at all the routes only two people seem to have crossed impassable fences, one overseas guy and one who should have known better! He must have got a lot of shocks as the fences he did cross were all electrified! Note they are impassable (i.e. not to be crossed), not uncrossable (impossible to cross)

I wasn't involved in sending the data to routegadget but I suspect the reason the crossing points aren't shown is because they weren't on the overall map, but were on the individual courses. The reason for that was because the maps were being litho printed and to have purple on the base map rather than the course maps would have been another plate adding to the cost.

Re the stile symbol - yes it is BOF not IOF, I did ask that it went onto the legend on the map (more than once) but it didn't get there. I was told it would be on the seperate legends that were available - never kept one of these so I don't know if it did or not. However you did have one on the warm-up map and I assume most runners went through it.