vetting and barring scheme

[RJ]

Volunteer levels in the Lakes really must be at an all time high right now. And no wonder, with that kind of attitude...

I'm sure children will be much safer on the fells being looked after by under-qualified but disclosure-checked adults once all the rest of us have got too fed up to bother.

Bit of a silly comment that, Patrick. I don't think, to the best of my knowledge, that we have anyone who thinks they have 150 forms to fill in. I think everyone is quite happy to complete the one or two forms.... the risk assessment and the lesson plan for the session!

And.... how dare you infer that we might be 'under-qualified'!! Bloody cheek! That will certainly ruffle a few feathers. Perhaps that's what you had in mind??

Blanka was being disingenuous by suggesting that there were 150 forms to fill in. I think you will find, Patrick, that there are dozens of clubs around the country where volunteers are just getting on with 'volunteering' and completing the relevant forms as they are obliged to do. It is the silent majority who keep this sport going.... and many thanks to all of them.... a job well done. Blanka is probably one of the silent majority as well, and she probably does quite a bit herself. Probably just being provocative!

[Meat Market]

RJ,

It's not the form filling that I'm bothered with but the 12 week- 5month wait for the local council to carry out police checks/ push paper around etc. The range I've quoted is typical as well for after school workers based on my 4 experiences in 3 different council areas in scotland.

Cheers, Duncan

[Patrick]

RJ, the logical conclusion of the new system is that by 2015 every helper at every event is going to have to have had the appropriate checks carried out, and that if anyone is found not to have done so then the organising club will be liable for a hefty fine. Do you really believe that is a worthwhile or sustainable situation? Would you want to be the organiser of a major event with the responsibility of ensuring such compliance added to all your other tasks?

With regard to the "under-qualified" comment, my point is that The Powers That Be would prefer disclosure-checked adults who might never have seen a compass to be involved in coaching than experienced orienteers who don't have the necessary clearance. I don't agree with those priorities - maybe you do.

Cheers,

Patrick

[ryeland of doom]

Another turn of the screw from this disgusting authoritarian shower of a government.
There is only one logical outcome to this, and I have already seen it happen in another sport (insurance were the baddies there).

Public orienteering will be an over 18s only activity. Don't they just love unintended consequences... or is it policy to spread misery.

[bendover]

sign here:

http://petitions.number10.gov.uk/AntiVetting/

i never thought that i would say i hate a labour government, but this is the final straw. and i very much doubt that the bloody tories will be any better.

[awk]

Regarding paperwork, awk, I agree. It is a hassle. But if you are going to coach, just get on with it, deal with it, and do the work. Producing some competent orienteers is well worth the effort.... yea?

Wrong way round! The fact is that I'm not going to do the work (which isn't just form filling, but also other work that is even more time consuming), so the result is it looks like I'm not going to coach. I'm simply no longer prepared to commit so much of my limited spare time on so much unproductive and unrewarding work (I don't actually enjoy doing first aid courses, filling in forms, carrying out risk assessments, renewing qualifications etc etc:). I did some of that in order to do what I enjoy, which is coach, but it's now reached the point where there are plenty of other rewarding things to do, in orienteering and beyond.

It seems to me that the discussion so far mostly ignores the point that this is a law being implemented. You have only a choice of two things: either comply with the law or avoid doing the things that require you to comply ie don't do certain volunteering jobs.

Haven't ignored it at all. Being a law doesn't make it a good thing: the old saw, the law is an ass, has never had more resonance than it does today.

Perhpas that's what some are saying, but if you decide to stop doing certain volunteering roles, it's your decision taken in reaction to the implementation of a law brought in by our elected government.

Exactly. Is there a problem with that? (BTW, elected, but not by a majority, not even of those who voted).

[Roger]

I'm simply no longer prepared to commit so much of my limited spare time on so much unproductive and unrewarding work...

Snap.

I've just resigned as Chairman of the Oxon Schools Chess Association because I was depressed by the way that the child-protection legislation is moving, and I wasn't prepared to put time and effort into establishing and running a volunteer control system of dubious efficacy. I find other voluntary activities, like coaching orienteering or maintaining our chess results submission service (shh... don't tell BOF) more enjoyable. We now have no Chairman.

[geomorph]

On a point of legal order I'm quite surprised to hear that motoring offences like speeding are included as I didn't think they were classed as criminal offences in law!

Speeding is quite definitely a "criminal offence" - what else would it be? Under the current system it would show up on an Enhanced CRB check if it were relevant to the position you were being checked for (eg. if you were applying for a position driving a school minibus).

But does not having been convicted mean that you don't regularly speed?
Getting caught by mobile/unmarked car cameras is a lottery. If you are caught by a clearly marked fixed camera then you are a fool.

But can anybody substantiate that the fool is less safe than the 'caught at mobile' than the 'not caught yet'?

They installed speed warning poles in the next village. 3 years later analysis of the data showed that 73% of vehicles exceeded the trigger speed by 5% or more.

Would these people suddenly not speed if they were driving a school mini-bus?

Of course, once we are all linked up to satellite-based pay-as-you go road usage, then the 'never-speeder' can be identified, and certified as ok to drive the school mini-bus and those 3 people (two of whom didn't exceed 20mph anywhere, and the other who took 6 minutes to make a right at a tee) can drive the nations school's mini-buses


I'm saddened to hear that several nopers are giving up some/all volunteering because of the burden of admin. Hope you re-consider. I'm going to get my clearances, not cos I think the process is right, but 'cos I'm told I make a difference where it counts

[SeanC]

I'm not trying to defend the scheme, but BOF are probably right to say "don't panic". From reading the q and a's on the BBC website it would seem to me that the proposed guidance will not affect the vast majority of Orienteering volunteers.

BBC news wrote:

Q: I volunteer at my child's sports club - do I have to apply?

A: Yes, anyone working or volunteering on behalf of a third party organisation, for example a sports club or a charity who has frequent or intensive access to children or vulnerable adults will have to be registered with the scheme. For volunteers, registration is free.

However, the VBS does not cover personal or family relationships, so parents making informal arrangements to give lifts to children will not have to be vetted.

If you volunteer with more than one club you only need to be registered once - the club can then check you have a registration - as long as you give your consent.

Q I occasionally help with reading at a school: do they mean me?

The checks will be necessary for anyone who has contact regularly, intensively or overnight - defined as once a month, three times or more in a period of 30 days, or between the hours of 2am and 6am.

The definition of frequent and intensive access is key and from reading this Q and A it seems most orienteering volunteers do not fall within the category.

Yes I found the CRB check for coaching and the first aid course extra hurdles that have delayed my qualification, the bigger barrier was finding a course on a suitable weekend that didn't involve lots of travelling. However the (UKCC level 1) course was really good. The exercises covered are not just the basic exercises aimed at yellow standard, but exercises you can use to teach adults/intermediate standard orienteers (eg relocation, pacing, attack points). Don't let the paperwork put you off if you want to get involved with coaching.

[Scott]

They installed speed warning poles in the next village. 3 years later analysis of the data showed that 73% of vehicles exceeded the trigger speed by 5% or more.

Would these people suddenly not speed if they were driving a school mini-bus?

But (and after all, this is what this whole thing is all about) imagine the subsequent media outrage if someone crashed the school minibus while speeding and then turned out to have had previous speeding convictions...

Getting caught by mobile/unmarked car cameras is a lottery.

Unless you, erm, don't break the speed limit.

[Knee Deep Mud!]

There is only one logical outcome to this, and I have already seen it happen in another sport (insurance were the baddies there). Public orienteering will be an over 18s only activity.

Exactly the result I've seen in another volunteer organisation I'm in, when the paperwork got too onerous.

[SeanC]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/education/10314055.stm

[EddieH]

Common sense has prevailed. The very worst thing about all this politically correct nonsense is the fear and suspicion that it generates. Orienteering is about the only activity in which I dare speak to a child. How can that be healthy for society.
I see it ias entirely synonymous with the ultra clean trend - society is becoming incapable of fighting off standard bugs because it is prevented from natural aclimatisation to them. The preventative measures ( chemicals) then destroy the good and the bad.