"At last years WMOC final the taped route to the start kite was so far that we were catching people from the previous minutes's start block..."
However as the pre start was not on the map and no-one could have any idea where it was in relation to the start, no-one could possibly have gained any advantage from not going all the way to the start. Mind you Elizabeth Brown's 1.3 k must have really been 50% longer.
Anyone remember a Scottish relays at Anagach where the taped (unmeasured) route to the start was well over 1k.
BEOC Long / FCC Final
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Re: BEOC Long / FCC Final
greywolf wrote:The guidelines say a top elite should be able to run the M55L course in 42 mins (75 mins * 0.56)...
I think they're (technically) ratios of corrected length (straight line length + 0.1km per 10m climb), based on an M21L with a hypothetical elite winning time of 75, rather than ratios of time.
The corrected length of M21L yesterday was 16.05 and that of M55L was 9.15, giving a ratio of 0.570 - pretty close to the guideline of 0.56. Perhaps M21L was too short? The ratio of M21E was 1.405, rather longer than the guideline ratio of 1.20, which suggests it might have been, but then the M21E winning time was also over the recommended 90mins, so maybe M21E was too long instead. And that doesn't take into account the difference in speed between the two areas.
I conclusion, I don't know. Not sure it matters that much - everyone I spoke to thought that they were good courses. Did anybody actually complain about the length (either way)?
"If only you were younger and better..."
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Scott - god
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Re: BEOC Long / FCC Final
Scott wrote:I think they're (technically) ratios of corrected length (straight line length + 0.1km per 10m climb).....rather than ratios of time....And that doesn't take into account the difference in speed between the two areas.
Yes, thats true, although the Planning Appendix has a list of things to consider when applying the course length ratios, (e.g. "M21 probably uses the whole area. The shorter courses use only part of it, and this might be more or less runnable, or steeper/flatter, than the average")
But yes - the most important thing is good quality courses
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greywolf - addict
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Re: BEOC Long / FCC Final
So back onto the FCC, I don't really understand why it's going to take another 2 weeks to select the team. Both times I went to JWOC the selectors met that afternoon and the selections came out either on the Monday or very early the next week.
And again, does anyone know who Richard Barker is? The other two selectors have/are both highly involved with elite junior orienteering. I'm just interested to see what Barker's background is.
And again, does anyone know who Richard Barker is? The other two selectors have/are both highly involved with elite junior orienteering. I'm just interested to see what Barker's background is.
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mharky - team nopesport
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Re: BEOC Long / FCC Final
A quick look suggests that he's been involved with coaching and the East Anglian Junior Squad for a number of years; this is the third year he's been on the junior selection panel.
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distracted - addict
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Re: BEOC Long / FCC Final
June 2006 Coaching Committee minutes wrote:New selector: Richard Barker was nominated to replace Bill Stevenson. This was agreed and it was felt that given Richard’s level of experience, involvement and coaching qualifications he will be an asset to the selection panel.
Not overly enlightening. I believe he's involved with EAJS and has coached on Lagganlia in the recent past.
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Scott - god
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Re: BEOC Long / FCC Final
Those minutes linked by Scott also indicate that Derek Allison, Director of Coaching was in attendance, would that be the same Derek Allison which BOF proudly displays on it's front page as the newly appointed Director of Coaching?
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Gross - god
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Re: BEOC Long / FCC Final
mharky wrote: I don't really understand why it's going to take another 2 weeks to select the team. Both times I went to JWOC the selectors met that afternoon and the selections came out either on the Monday or very early the next week.
Selection timing seems a bit random just now.... World Games Team wasn't meant to be announced until June 15th... but it's up there on the BOF website, even before the last test races next weekend. I guess the powers that be change policy every now & then - as long as the athletes involved know then it's no big deal... so hopefully any juniors waiting for the call today were fully aware it'll take a couple of weeks.
Go orienteering in Lithuania......... best in the world:)
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Gross - god
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Re: BEOC Long / FCC Final
The World Games entry deadline was brought forward to mid-April, so the selection races were changed to the JK Sprint and Middle. I think the athletes were informed.
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Scott - god
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Re: BEOC Long / FCC Final
Knew about the date changed & assumed that was the case... but BOF website selection policy 2009 still states next weekend as a test race. It all seems about pleasing the paymasters at the moment and having 'wrong' information available to the public isn't the best approach.
Go orienteering in Lithuania......... best in the world:)
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Gross - god
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Re: BEOC Long / FCC Final
And going back to BEOC..... congrats to Oli on win number 3, can he make in 4 next year? Will he beat Celtic's '9 in a row'?
Go orienteering in Lithuania......... best in the world:)
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Re: BEOC Long / FCC Final
Lard wrote:I know the rules, unlike the guy starting 3 minutes before me yesterday!![]()
I cant find the BOF rule anywhere.
Anyone who didn't go to the start kite yesterday was an idiot and fully deserved any time lost. That would include the guy who finish 3 minutes and 1 second ahead of you!

Coming soon
Boston City Race (May, maybe not)
Coasts and Islands (Shetland)
SprintScotland https://sprintscotland.weebly.com/
Boston City Race (May, maybe not)
Coasts and Islands (Shetland)
SprintScotland https://sprintscotland.weebly.com/
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graeme - god
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Re: BEOC Long / FCC Final
Lard wrote:Does anyone else not want to see a ditch ever again after yesterday!
I was wondering about the ditches - who built them? when? and how much difference have they made to the land - would it be jusr a huge marsh without them?
Thoroughly enjoyed the weekend - very nice atmosphere in the field i thought - we have been very lucky with the weather at the big events so far this year - let's hope it continues!
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Mrs H - god
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Re: BEOC Long / FCC Final
I am very concerned about the ditches which were there in abundance on the Short Green coourse on Saturday in abundance. This course was the one pre designated for W80. I, a very slow, overweight W60, had trouble crossing some of them. Then part way through my course I had to pull a W80(87 actually) out of a ditch. She hadn't been able to jump across, had slid down into the ditch and wasn't able to get any traction on the ditch sides to get out. I fail to understand how the planner and contoller expected these elderly ladies to cross the ditches
. Surely this course should not have been their designated on for that particular area. Would there have been any harm them being assigned to the Light Green, providing there were no similar problems, or the Orange course on this specific occassion? 


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Re: BEOC Long / FCC Final
Four pages in - about time someone mentioned the maps... I don't expect to be able to read the detail at 1:15 nowadays, but with the magnifier (and lard) I had a general idea what was going on in the detailed bits. Only real trouble was 1-2, but that's mainly due to the red line obscuring the stream.
On the BEOC maps, they took off all the rootstocks. I can honestly say that at no point was I thinking "it would really help my navigation if that rootstock was on the map".
The northern section (19-22 on M21E) was heavily brash and an undergrowth screen would be correct. But it wouldn't have helped navigation and would have made it much harder to read. Another good call.
For similar reasons, I don't understand the green on the eastern slag heap: its never going to be used for "over or round" route choice, and even if it was, the hill is clean underfoot and perfectly runnable (steepness aside).
The greens on the BEOC map are much darker than on the 1:10000 (slow run = walk).
North seems to have rotated rather a long way since the JK
So, a nice demonstration that litho-print 1:15000 is quite adequate even with some quite detailed bits.
On the BEOC maps, they took off all the rootstocks. I can honestly say that at no point was I thinking "it would really help my navigation if that rootstock was on the map".
The northern section (19-22 on M21E) was heavily brash and an undergrowth screen would be correct. But it wouldn't have helped navigation and would have made it much harder to read. Another good call.
For similar reasons, I don't understand the green on the eastern slag heap: its never going to be used for "over or round" route choice, and even if it was, the hill is clean underfoot and perfectly runnable (steepness aside).
The greens on the BEOC map are much darker than on the 1:10000 (slow run = walk).
North seems to have rotated rather a long way since the JK

So, a nice demonstration that litho-print 1:15000 is quite adequate even with some quite detailed bits.
Coming soon
Boston City Race (May, maybe not)
Coasts and Islands (Shetland)
SprintScotland https://sprintscotland.weebly.com/
Boston City Race (May, maybe not)
Coasts and Islands (Shetland)
SprintScotland https://sprintscotland.weebly.com/
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