New Event Structure

[graeme]

Are you using Age Category or Colour-Coded courses for Tay 2009, Graeme?

Numbered courses from 1-50 - Enter now before they fill up.

and I shall ignore the rhetorical nature of the question in order to place an ad.

http://www.scottish6days.com/2009/about ... on-details

[awk]

From what we have been told it would seem more logical than today:
Level 1 event = Grade 1 controller
Level 2 event = Grade 2 controller
Level 3 event = Grade 3 controller, or at least someone checking that obvious things like the risk assesment have been done

Except that under the new scheme there will be a lot more level 2 events than previously, and there is already a shortage of G2 controllers. Thinking back what seems a long way, we reckoned that G3 controllers would be needed to control the new level 2 events.

[awk]

- but what about the dreaded Ranking lists?

Take a look at the news section of BOF site, about a week ago for an item that might start explaining this......

The Event Review group proposed (and it was accepted) that we would move to a single list rankings, from which could be extracted age group/gender rankings etc. It was a major part of the restructuring.

But we've got yet another review group before these agreed recommendations are even implemented, so goodness only knows what happens now.

Go on, why not go the whole hog, and review the new event structure before we implement it?

[NeilC]

Except that under the new scheme there will be a lot more level 2 events than previously.

Will there really be more? I thought that some sort of quality threshold was to be applied to Level 2 events to avoid having too many ranking events. There might even then be less level 2 events than there currently are level 3 (badge/regional) ones, ie the ones requiring a grade 2 controller.

Will not the the new level 3 band become by far the largest one - containing what are now local, district and some regional. How these are controlled becomes the more interesting issue.

[Scott]

My understanding was that the review intended for all current level 3 (regional) events the majority of current level 4 (district) events to be level 2 under the new structure, reflecting the fact that there was no longer any difference in event quality between levels 3 and 4. However, every club I've spoken to seems to be intending for their current district events to become level 3 under the new structure, and to leave their current regional events as level 2, which I'm not sure is what the review were hoping for.

EDIT: Focus hasn't made it as far as Cornwall yet, though, so I could be completely wrong on that...

[Scott]

Will there really be more? I thought that some sort of quality threshold was to be applied to Level 2 events to avoid having too many ranking events.

In fact, wasn't the ESRG actually trying to achieve an increase in the number of ranking events, so it would act as more of an incentive scheme (and be more relevant to people outside the SE/SC axis of weekly regionals)? That was the impression I had, anyway.

[summo]

It improve the number of people running per course, a look at the October Oddessy shows several classes with only 1 runner, if these we rationalised into a smaller range of courses for both sexes, then it would be simplified.

Using OO as an example, 11 courses catering for over 50 M/F age classes, versus just having 11 courses, run which you want to.

[awk]

Your understanding in both posts is spot on Scott. I'd be really disappointed if clubs parked their district events at L3 - way too informal a level for them, and reducing the availability of ranking events. Which is why I'm a bit bemused that as we approach the onset of the new system, there's been nothing about it anywhere, unless there's a detailed intro in Focus (it's not reached this part of Yorkshire yet either).

[NeilC]

So apart from ranking status how would / could you define the difference between a level 2 and 3 event? What is the incentive / disincentive for a club to register their event at either level? Levy is the same for both now is it not?

[seabird]

Is this up on the web yet?

Like many my copy of Focus has yet to arrive. In an hour we have our annual fixtures meeting. it would be a very useful document to have sight of.

[Scott]

The new Focus isn't up in the members' area of the BOF website yet. (What do you mean, you've forgotten your password?) You can try to piece things together from EC minutes and the rather old ESRG report that's on the website, but I have a suspicion that things may have changed a little since then.

Thinking about it, it might have been wise to circulate this information more widely a few weeks ago - rather than just before the national FG meeting, when all the regions are trying to sort themselves out...

[graeme]

Your understanding in both posts is spot on Scott. I'd be really disappointed if clubs parked their district events at L3 - way too informal a level for them,

This is the advice which SOA fixtures has received: C4 League -> L3.
We couldn't sustain them at level 2 because there aren't enough level 2 controllers.

Needless to say, this is not what the review intended.

how would / could you define the difference between a level 2 and 3 event

The review had a fairly clear picture. Level 2 was a proper event, you could expect epunching, overprinted maps, someone checking the controls were in the right place etc.

Level 3 was more informal, no controlling, (master) maps printed off at home, amatuer mapping, hope the controls are in the right place, but be laid back about it if not, pin/honesty punching.

The review worked hard to avoid creating incentives to downgrade good events. The L2 controller issue has put those perverse incentives back again.

[SJC]

Using OO as an example, 11 courses catering for over 50 M/F age classes, versus just having 11 courses, run which you want to.

Wasnt't this tried out a few years ago, at the White Rose amongst other events, and not taken any further because nobody seemed to like it ?

The review had a fairly clear picture. Level 2 was a proper event, you could expect epunching, overprinted maps, someone checking the controls were in the right place etc.

Events seem to have overtaken the review here. Every event I have been to this year, including all the local events, have had e-punching and professionally overprinted maps. This now seems to be the norm for most of central / southern England. Does this mean the yshould all be level 2 ?

[awk]

Wasnt't this tried out a few years ago, at the White Rose amongst other events, and not taken any further because nobody seemed to like it ?

As I understood it from the person carrying out the review of this, the feedback was positive.

Events seem to have overtaken the review here. Every event I have been to this year, including all the local events, have had e-punching and professionally overprinted maps. This now seems to be the norm for most of central / southern England. Does this mean the yshould all be level 2 ?

And proper controlling? Whilst quite a lot of informals round here have epunching and premarked (although few professionally done) maps, very few, if any, have controllers, and most have a limited range of courses (certainly not all TDs). The old Grade 3 controlling was intended for the new Level 2 events.

But, as Graeme touched on, once the scheme started being "improved", quite a bit of the coherence and thinking (of which there was far more than some gave credit for) was undermined, or perhas misunderstood. Not surprising when a scheme devised and worked through by one group of people over an extended period of time is taken over by another group who have no real ownership of/commitment to it. That's been shown time after time when it comes to event structure in particular.

[SYO Member]

Scott's right, the proposed Event Structure has changed. In April, I reported to our committee after attending a YHOA committee meeting that the BOF Events Committee on March 8th did accept the then revised proposals of the ESRG which were:

Level 1 - C1, 6 new Regional Champs. similar to C2's and CSC Final
Level 2 - C3 and C4
Level 3 - C5's or similar

In Focus, it is now:

Level 1 - C1, 6 new Regional Champs. similar to C2's
Level 2 - C3
Level 3 - C4 and C5's or similar but C4's can be upgraded to Level 2

How this has changed I do not know, but in the first set, clubs could move a 'C4' to a Level 3 if they wished. Likewise in the second set, they can upgrade a 'C4' to Level 2. Not sure about the CSC Final in the second set.

I have no problems with either set as my criteria for attending an event will remain unchanged, i.e. quality of the terrain, distance to travel and whether it is a new area for me.