I think you can blame the planner for that long boring track leg. Having looked at the map, I'd take that route every time. Even if the other route may have turned out to be quicker (very marginal surely), there's no way you can tell off the map that that series of indistinct paths are going to be any good to run on.
Like Brucey I'm very glad I didn't go and not just because I may have been Northroped for the first time.
British Champs.
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Graeme wrote:Maybe I was lucky to get one of the better-planned courses (M40), but I think some of you are confusing poor planning with a poor area. We had some technical short legs at the start, a long route choice leg (left through the heather, waaay right on paths and over all being options). After that the planner used the shape of the hill so you couldn't see where you were going until you got almost there, opening up the possibility of getting too high or low. The very fast section at the end penalised anyone who set off too fast.
For the longer courses, it would have been better to have the forest bit in the middle to break things up, give a bit of variety and a chance to get into the map, but that would have compromised the shorter courses.
I haven't seen the UKCup course, but Ed's post suggests that most of you did a long, boring track run which wasn't the fastest route. You can hardly blame the planner for that!
I agree the area was better than some other "quality" areas (Wharnecliffe, Cannock Chase, etc.) - and I thought the planning was good, given the constraints of having to have the full range of short/easy, long/hard, short/hard courses. I have to say that I disagree with the planners on their analysis of the best route choice though - basically it sounds similar to Graeme's leg of;
1 - round to the left (about 800m forest road downhill, then 800m gentle climb (40m?) on a good track, then a cut across to the path along the ridge, then downhill 1km through terrain to the control
2 - big climb onto the ridge, then along the ridge and the same ending as (1)
3 - all the way round to the right (about 300m longer than left, but with next to no climb (or descent), and a mix of small paths/terrain).
The sensible options were (1) or (3), and given that 1 was shorter and had good running for 2/3rds of the leg (and even the descent to the control was really fast, although you couldn't tell from the map what it would be like) then I can't see how 3 could have been quicker.
Having said that, I might go and run it in training sometime just to find out...
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Ed - diehard
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With regards to the date Graeme - surely if the British was held on the Saturday and sunday of the early may bank holiday - it would be just the same as it is for the Scottish and just give everyone else a bit more time to get home - what do you think? and yes ofcourse Ipod you could get bad weather at any time of the year - it always only a question of the balance of probability - I always thought it was taking a chance and there were other boring mumsy type factors to be taken into consideration so early such as - no camp sites open, no tourist attractions open - hardly a cream tea insight - darker evenings to do the travelling - the courses can be hard and tough - but does everything else have to be?
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Mrs H. - nope godmother
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I thought NEOA did a top job of trying to cope with the gale force winds/driving rain on the day. Having acted as a human tent peg for a while i can confirm that that download tent was never going to stay up! But if it was no kag no go etc months before the even surely they were expecting bad weather and could have planned a bit better for it?
As for the courses, i thought they were ok, but our two long legs were both fell races. If you're going to have a long leg, there's not much point in having a crossing point close to the control, it just turns it into a short leg with a slog beforehand. I thought the stuff in the green was quite fun though, and the short legs at the end definately lost a few people some time. (obviously i'm not going to complain about the courses much, it suited me fine!)
As for the courses, i thought they were ok, but our two long legs were both fell races. If you're going to have a long leg, there's not much point in having a crossing point close to the control, it just turns it into a short leg with a slog beforehand. I thought the stuff in the green was quite fun though, and the short legs at the end definately lost a few people some time. (obviously i'm not going to complain about the courses much, it suited me fine!)
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Rach - red
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just looked at the Times, Result Service, and it has the UK cup results, well done to Mr Writhrop!! who came 3rd.
another quality name error, but still never seen one to rival Jamie Does or Jamie Dog!!
another quality name error, but still never seen one to rival Jamie Does or Jamie Dog!!
'Grab it by the balls'
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the duncan - diehard
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Sterling efforts made by the organisational team to cope with the weather on the day (especially those on car parking). Unfortunately in my opinion the event just was not good enough.
I got to the start late - the whistle went as I arrived - my fault for being late. I was ushered to the late start lane and was told that there was no rush etc. Gave my name, got my SI cleared told to wait in the late start lane until those infront of me has gone, and realised after a while that start times were not being changed. Getting a bit irate at being told to wait, for no good reason, whilst the clock ticked, I was allowed to go, 2 mins after my original start time! I don't mind keeping an orderly queue at the late start if start times are going to be changed, but if they are not, holding people back is out of order.
Rushed out of the start and did a headless chicken out of the control. Was too high by 10 metres, but as Helen Palmer will attest to the map in this area was wholly inaccurate ('we could be too high' ' but what about that big crag over there, it must be on the map?'). Next control, big fence also not on the map. Rest of the course was really, really boring. Would have retired after coming out of the forest if the finish wasn't miles away. Feel sorry for those for whom this was their british champs. Surely the north east has better areas?
Cheered up immensly at the sight of an old bloke in nothing but his M&S briefs getting changed in a Rothbury carpark!
I got to the start late - the whistle went as I arrived - my fault for being late. I was ushered to the late start lane and was told that there was no rush etc. Gave my name, got my SI cleared told to wait in the late start lane until those infront of me has gone, and realised after a while that start times were not being changed. Getting a bit irate at being told to wait, for no good reason, whilst the clock ticked, I was allowed to go, 2 mins after my original start time! I don't mind keeping an orderly queue at the late start if start times are going to be changed, but if they are not, holding people back is out of order.
Rushed out of the start and did a headless chicken out of the control. Was too high by 10 metres, but as Helen Palmer will attest to the map in this area was wholly inaccurate ('we could be too high' ' but what about that big crag over there, it must be on the map?'). Next control, big fence also not on the map. Rest of the course was really, really boring. Would have retired after coming out of the forest if the finish wasn't miles away. Feel sorry for those for whom this was their british champs. Surely the north east has better areas?
Cheered up immensly at the sight of an old bloke in nothing but his M&S briefs getting changed in a Rothbury carpark!
- Claire Ward
BOC dates
Mrs H. wrote:With regards to the date Graeme - surely if the British was held on the Saturday and sunday of the early may bank holiday - it would be just the same as it is for the Scottish and just give everyone else a bit more time to get home - what do you think?
In principle it would be fine: BOC on Saturday, BRC on Sunday, some non-championship event on Monday. In practice using May Day w/e has been tried three times in the last decade or so, and on each occasion the relay was pushed onto the Monday, and on each previous occasion Interlopers have been told to [nope] off when we complained and got cuffed in the relay when our best runners were at work.
Meanwhile - who liked the 1:10000 and who would have preferred the 1:15000?
Graeme
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graeme - god
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Anonymous wrote:Ed wrote:I agree the area was better than some other "quality" areas (Wharnecliffe, Cannock Chase, etc.) ...
Be serious Ed! Wharncliffe is not the worlds greatest forest, but as an area for interesting and challenging orienteering, is head and shoulders above last weekend.
It's a matter of opinion - but I beg to differ. OK, I've only once run at Wharnecliffe but I didn't find it that remarkable. I'll grant that Simonside's not the most technical area, but I have to say I found Saturday's course both interesting and challenging - apart from 2/3rds of the long leg then I was running straight through the terrain and feeling a need to keep an eye on the map and my compass - it would have been pretty easy to drift or head out of a control off-bearing and lose a bit of time (ok, once or twice like #11 I was running along thinking "this could be really tricky if it's tucked in, and then it wasn't, which was nice). Without the long leg it might have been possible to have an entire course without running once on a path. Give me that every time over almost any woods where each leg is basically either very short or 'out to the path, along to the attack point, and in'
Oh - and in reply to Graeme, 1:15,000 would have been nice - less chance of blowing away...
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Ed - diehard
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Claire Ward wrote:I have 20/20 vision, but if the JK is really going to be 1:15000, I shall be buying a magnifier.
it is, or so the programme says.
i think i would have preferred the 1:15000 on saturday as i nearly lost my map in the wind at one point, which would have been pretty nasty...
Andrew Dalgleish (INT)
Views expressed on Nopesport are my own.
Views expressed on Nopesport are my own.
- andy
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BOC a waste of time
Travelled for 6.5 hours in nightmare traffic and weather, to be greeted with what I would call one of the biggest shambles since I last planned an event. Yeah ok the weather played a large part on the day, but from the stupidly long walk to the start to the unbelievable placing of the start lanes and the fact that the start kite was behind you when you picked your map up added to the sham. Wouldn't it have been better to have thestart kite in the open to the south?
As for using the wooded area, that was just as bad as the heather on the moorland. I'm sure that there must be better areas in the North of England.
The cancellation of the second day meant that we'd travelled a 12 hour round trip for one pretty average event.
As for using the wooded area, that was just as bad as the heather on the moorland. I'm sure that there must be better areas in the North of England.
The cancellation of the second day meant that we'd travelled a 12 hour round trip for one pretty average event.
- Rich k
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