Proposed levy changes
• Existing levies:
o SOA: £1/senior, £0.40/junior when Senior fee >£10. Raises ca. £3,500 pa
o BOF: £1.50/senior, £0.50/junior for all events. Raises ca. £28,000 pa
• Proposed new SOA levy options:
o Levy all competitors at all events
o Levy at £2 for national events and above (SOL+). Would raise ca. £7-10k pa
o Levy at £1 for regional events. Would raise ca. £5.5-7k pa
o Levy at £1 for local events. Would raise ca. £11-14k
o In total this would raise between £25-30k
These levies do not include the 6 Days which separately generates ca. £20k pa for the SOA. We also raise ca. £7k pa from SOA membership fees and as noted above ca. £3k from levies. The total of £30k covers the costs of running the SOA (including a part-time COO and an admin officer).
The above proposal would fund about one full time employee. We currently provide part time professional support for competition co-ordination (no volunteer could be found), access issues, technical advice (e.g. on LIDAR) etc.
SOA - Proposed levy changes
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SOA - Proposed levy changes
Simon Firth - ESOC
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- smf
- green
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Re: SOA - Proposed levy changes
On the face of it, these look reasonable. I don't know if the projected amounts raised assume no effect on participation numbers? If so, it will be interesting to see how that plays out.
It's disappointing to see juniors and newcomers treated the same as regular adults. Reduces the scope for discounts to bring new people into the sport. Also disproportionately hits families and increases the risk of putting on small scale or experimental events, which again doesn't seem like the right approach to build a sustainable future.
It's disappointing to see juniors and newcomers treated the same as regular adults. Reduces the scope for discounts to bring new people into the sport. Also disproportionately hits families and increases the risk of putting on small scale or experimental events, which again doesn't seem like the right approach to build a sustainable future.
- spitalfields
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Re: SOA - Proposed levy changes
How much is it costing the SOA to insure members who don't have a BOF membership, and how many of these members are there? Do these members cover their costs? Or, are they costing the SOA money?
- Hermes
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Re: SOA - Proposed levy changes
As always with these things the situation is a bit more complex than you think. Though there is a cost associated with insurance of SOA only members this has to be balanced against increased membership numbers which in turn help meet the growth targets set by Sportscotland. Funding from Sportscotland is dependant on us reaching these targets. This money is then used for orienteering development purposes but cannot be used for other SOA business (including most of my time as Events Manager), office admin and the COO.
Fac et Spera. Views expressed are not necessarily those of the Scottish 6 Days Assistant Coordinator
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Freefall - addict
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Re: SOA - Proposed levy changes
Hermes wrote:How much is it costing the SOA to insure members who don't have a BOF membership?
Presumably zero since the BOF insurance now covers non-members for any number of events.
- pete.owens
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Re: SOA - Proposed levy changes
spitalfields wrote:On the face of it, these look reasonable. I don't know if the projected amounts raised assume no effect on participation numbers? If so, it will be interesting to see how that plays out.
It's disappointing to see juniors and newcomers treated the same as regular adults. Reduces the scope for discounts to bring new people into the sport. Also disproportionately hits families and increases the risk of putting on small scale or experimental events, which again doesn't seem like the right approach to build a sustainable future.
As the architect of the proposals I would like to comment that there is nothing in them that states that event fees need to cover all or indeed any of the cost of the levy. The choice of £1 per run was made to allow an easy quick way of identifying the likely amount that can be raised by the new levy.
If a club wants to offer cheap or free entry to newcomers they are free to do so. If a club wants to increase club membership fees to a high level and offer free runs to all club members at each event they can do so. The method of raising the levy is not being specified, that is up to each club to decide.
The driving force behind the levy proposal is to increase the amount of money that SOA raises and thus can spend on development aspects that it chooses (rather than those specified by Sport Scotland). The hope, and expectation, is that the money raised will benefit the sport and thus lead to more members, more runs and thus more money in the sport overall.
- Big Jon
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Re: SOA - Proposed levy changes
Hermes wrote:How much is it costing the SOA to insure members who don't have a BOF membership, ...
Going forward, won't this be zero? Or does it extend to something beyond the BOF policy (third-party liability for events and activities)?
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Re: SOA - Proposed levy changes
Big Jon wrote:As the architect of the proposals I would like to comment that there is nothing in them that states that event fees need to cover all or indeed any of the cost of the levy...
If a club wants to offer cheap or free entry to newcomers they are free to do so.
Fair point. Though I assume the club will need to fund this somehow? I have nothing against clubs funding development activity, and indeed am someone who believes they should. But this is typically easier for some clubs than it is for others. And it may be that those most in need of this sort of thing are those with fewest resources to provide it.
Perhaps the additional resources created will more than compensate for the additional financial burden placed on clubs. I certainly hope that proves to be the case.
- spitalfields
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Re: SOA - Proposed levy changes
spitalfields wrote:Big Jon wrote:As the architect of the proposals I would like to comment that there is nothing in them that states that event fees need to cover all or indeed any of the cost of the levy...
If a club wants to offer cheap or free entry to newcomers they are free to do so.
Fair point. Though I assume the club will need to fund this somehow? I have nothing against clubs funding development activity, and indeed am someone who believes they should. But this is typically easier for some clubs than it is for others. And it may be that those most in need of this sort of thing are those with fewest resources to provide it.
Perhaps the additional resources created will more than compensate for the additional financial burden placed on clubs. I certainly hope that proves to be the case.
The proposal is for the funds raised to be used to support major events to increase standards and, hopefully, numbers attending events. Clubs should already be providing training and coaching for all - newcomers and established orienteers alike, otherwise how do they expect the club and sport to flourish?
- Big Jon
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Re: SOA - Proposed levy changes
I don't object in principle, and the sums involved aren't huge compared to the other costs involved in orienteering, but it would be nice if just for once someone at SOA and/or BOF addressed the question of why we have to fund both (through both membership and event levy) when there's clearly some duplication of delivery.
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greywolf - addict
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Re: SOA - Proposed levy changes
There are three things that BOF provides Scottish Orienteers that Scottish Orienteering does not, namely IOF affiliation, insurance and GB performance. The BOF levy pays for these.
- housewife
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Re: SOA - Proposed levy changes
Big Jon wrote:
The proposal is for the funds raised to be used to support major events to increase standards and, hopefully, numbers attending events. Clubs should already be providing training and coaching for all - newcomers and established orienteers alike, otherwise how do they expect the club and sport to flourish?
Careful now. My first impression was of a broadly reasonable proposal, and I was merely musing about the possibility of unintended consequences. The more detail you give, the more it sounds like an argument that to improve the village you need to gild the emperor's palace.
I know that from previous topics you have a view of development that, in my view, suggests a position of privilege that fails to acknowledge the realities that many others face. But I accept that I don't react well when people imply that simply saying something 'should' be happening is sufficient to overcome all of the complex reasons why something apparently desirable is not happening. So I will sit on that one. I sincerely hope that my concerns about unintended consequences are not warranted, and that the proposal delivers positive results.
Certainly if it works out as forecast, it can only be a good thing.
- spitalfields
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Re: SOA - Proposed levy changes
greywolf wrote:I don't object in principle, and the sums involved aren't huge compared to the other costs involved in orienteering, but it would be nice if just for once someone at SOA and/or BOF addressed the question of why we have to fund both (through both membership and event levy) when there's clearly some duplication of delivery.
Looking at it another way, Scotland has benefited from both Sport Scotland funding directly, and Sport England funding indirectly, despite only contributing once. Admittedly some of the Sport England funding has been targeted at the English regions but much of it supports BOF activities as a whole. I suspect this argument is mirrored throughout Scottish politics.
I've always been an admirer of the SOA and Scottish orienteering, and whilst I suspect much of the success is down to the people involved, I think you have benefited as a 'region' from strong local institutions and the extra costs are worth it. I'd like to see YHOA operating at a similar level.
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buzz - addict
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Re: SOA - Proposed levy changes
Interested to hear the ways in which you think Scottish Orirnteering has benefitted from Sport England funding?
- housewife
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Re: SOA - Proposed levy changes
housewife wrote:Interested to hear the ways in which you think Scottish Orirnteering has benefitted from Sport England funding?
Yeh I hesitated to use the word 'benefit', but money had been spent on infrastructure and UK wide programmes. Whether or not orienteering in the UK has benefited is a different matter. I'm not sure YHOA has benefited more than SOA from Sport England funding.
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