I'm interested to know whether people are aware of the BO Incentive Scheme. https://www.britishorienteering.org.uk/incentives
A lot of clubs seem inconsistent about uploading their Level D results to BO. It made me wonder whether the scheme wasn't quite as well known about as BO might hope. Maybe not all clubs realize that they need to do this so their newbie members get their event credits.
Although I think it's of no (personal) relevance to the average Nopesport poster I do think it's a worthwhile scheme for newcomers. Level Ds are the most popular events for newer members so if the scheme is to work as intended it needs feeding.
British Orienteering Incentive Scheme
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Re: British Orienteering Incentive Scheme
I get occasional emails from the system saying I've achieved an award, but it seems quite random.
Using email push is the right idea rather than relying on clubs to promote it, but I think it needs money and time spent on it, which seems unlikely. Eg people could do with regular (eg twice a year) summaries of the awards they've achieved and what awards are available.
Using email push is the right idea rather than relying on clubs to promote it, but I think it needs money and time spent on it, which seems unlikely. Eg people could do with regular (eg twice a year) summaries of the awards they've achieved and what awards are available.
- SeanC
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Re: British Orienteering Incentive Scheme
Well that's at least one then. Thanks Sean.
If it's automated presumably it ought to run (and promote) itself, meaning that all that's needed is for clubs to populate the results database.
Although from speaking to a couple of newish members up here who gave me a blank look, I'm not convinced that notifications go out consistently. Either that or people or their mailboxes ignore them as spam.
SeanC wrote:it needs money and time spent on it
If it's automated presumably it ought to run (and promote) itself, meaning that all that's needed is for clubs to populate the results database.
Although from speaking to a couple of newish members up here who gave me a blank look, I'm not convinced that notifications go out consistently. Either that or people or their mailboxes ignore them as spam.
- Sunlit Forres
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Re: British Orienteering Incentive Scheme
NWOA clubs recently agreed that very few pay any attention to these at all, but recognised the need for some award scheme for juniors.
We are now looking at bringing back cloth badges and asking all clubs to flag the colour standard in all results (apparently simple to do).
Yes it might be repeating something that was done in the past and felt to be old fashioned but we did a quick bit of research and found that similar schemes are used and popular.
(We did decide to update the design that was a bit too old and tired)
We are now looking at bringing back cloth badges and asking all clubs to flag the colour standard in all results (apparently simple to do).
Yes it might be repeating something that was done in the past and felt to be old fashioned but we did a quick bit of research and found that similar schemes are used and popular.
(We did decide to update the design that was a bit too old and tired)
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Re: British Orienteering Incentive Scheme
Sunlit Forres wrote:I'm interested to know whether people are aware of the BO Incentive Scheme. https://www.britishorienteering.org.uk/incentives
A lot of clubs seem inconsistent about uploading their Level D results to BO. It made me wonder whether the scheme wasn't quite as well known about as BO might hope. Maybe not all clubs realize that they need to do this so their newbie members get their event credits.
Although I think it's of no (personal) relevance to the average Nopesport poster I do think it's a worthwhile scheme for newcomers. Level Ds are the most popular events for newer members so if the scheme is to work as intended it needs feeding.
Some good points here. Part of the problem as youve hinted is that the people who have to put the results up probably are the average NOPE punter and therefore have no real incentive to upload them themselves - unless they have a kid who'll benefit. It does seem like just one more chore that actually isnt all that necessary unless your club has lots of juniors, but then there's the chicken/egg issue of when do you start doing it.
I think if BOF feel its important they should incentivise it by say, charging less levy if the results are uploaded, that sort of thing. I do think we all should be doing it, but frankly could see why people dont.
Orienteering - its no walk in the park
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Re: British Orienteering Incentive Scheme
Maroc AGM includes presentation of awards. All club juniors are presented with badges and certificates and list of their achievements read out - takes about 30-40 mins but worth it for the pleasure they get to have a load of rewards. Club pays for badges etc.
Takes some work but good to acknowledge the juniors performances.
Takes some work but good to acknowledge the juniors performances.
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Re: British Orienteering Incentive Scheme
The idea isn't so bad in principle, but the current execution leaves a fair bit to be desired.
- Most clubs only put up level C and above (i.e. ranking) to BOF
- Many local events are [correctly] level D and hence are often not put up by the club
- Even if you run, say, a Light Green then it doesn't count for the scheme unless certain words are used in the course description. Course 8 for instance or M14/W14 won't cut it.
JK
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Re: British Orienteering Incentive Scheme
JK wrote:the current execution leaves a fair bit to be desired
I've been corresponding with Scott Parker at BO who I think understands the importance of this scheme to the clubs that use it. As I suspected, there is a snag with the automated system meaning that emails informing members when they have achieved a level are not going out.
It seems that this has been the case for a long time but nobody has noticed. Has anyone on here received an incentive scheme email recently?
Scott said:
Thank you for sending through the details. I have requested for the website developers to have a look into this for me as it looks as though the emails are not being sent.
I will let you know once I have received a response from them however, they currently have a heavy workload as they are working on finalising the new website.
- Sunlit Forres
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Re: British Orienteering Incentive Scheme
As an example of course naming I had a quick look at the latest Results:
https://www.britishorienteering.org.uk/results
Now I'm not certain (since you can only see whether your own results count or not), but I suspect neither of the following would count for the incentive scheme for Light Green.
YHOA Champs: Course name is "LG"
Chiltern Challenge Course name is "Course LGR"
Looking back a bit further if you look at
12/11/16 LOC/SROC Weekend (UKOL)
I can see from my result that the following course didn't count as a Blue/TD5 result:
UKOL Blue Men (M55, M60, M16)
nor my JK Sprint last year (I don't think this is excluded by being Urban/Sprint, I think it is the name):
UKOL 6 (M50)
You can check your own results by logging into the BOF site and looking at the standard achieved in each one - and you'll see how restrictive it is to get a result to count.
Now I am not particularly bothered since I've achieved all the TD5 standards ages ago, but for new people aiming to get so many results at a standard then I suspect it is demoralising if they do plenty of events and then find that some don't get put up because they are D events and others dont' get put up because they are part of an event with age group classes and so they are put down as Course N instead of a colour (and technically for ranking points then the Blue should get bundled in with the age groupers on the same course), but worst of all is when an abbreviated name is used that is not one of the "approved" ones.
Cheers
JK
https://www.britishorienteering.org.uk/results
Now I'm not certain (since you can only see whether your own results count or not), but I suspect neither of the following would count for the incentive scheme for Light Green.
YHOA Champs: Course name is "LG"
Chiltern Challenge Course name is "Course LGR"
Looking back a bit further if you look at
12/11/16 LOC/SROC Weekend (UKOL)
I can see from my result that the following course didn't count as a Blue/TD5 result:
UKOL Blue Men (M55, M60, M16)
nor my JK Sprint last year (I don't think this is excluded by being Urban/Sprint, I think it is the name):
UKOL 6 (M50)
You can check your own results by logging into the BOF site and looking at the standard achieved in each one - and you'll see how restrictive it is to get a result to count.
Now I am not particularly bothered since I've achieved all the TD5 standards ages ago, but for new people aiming to get so many results at a standard then I suspect it is demoralising if they do plenty of events and then find that some don't get put up because they are D events and others dont' get put up because they are part of an event with age group classes and so they are put down as Course N instead of a colour (and technically for ranking points then the Blue should get bundled in with the age groupers on the same course), but worst of all is when an abbreviated name is used that is not one of the "approved" ones.
Cheers
JK
JK
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Re: British Orienteering Incentive Scheme
.. and even worse when the system doesn't work even when the courses ARE named as the system demands.
- Sunlit Forres
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Re: British Orienteering Incentive Scheme
Although the new system isn't designed for us old fogeys it obviously needs us to "buy into it" because we're often the people who are organising events, submitting results etc. and if we either don't understand it or don't think it's effective, the implementation of the system will be patchy at best. As it is, I don't think I understand it and I've not heard much about its effectiveness. If it requires a high level of consistency across the country in order to work I think it might be doomed, unless BOF pays someone to input and tidy up the results.
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Re: British Orienteering Incentive Scheme
Adrian wrote:Although the new system isn't designed for us old fogeys it obviously needs us to "buy into it" ...
While I agree with what you say it isn't exactly "new" - it has been around for some time now: I'm sure I printed off one of my 5* certs to "prove" basic competence for my L2 Coaching in 2013 or maybe 2014.
So, yes - whoever it is in BOF, or whoever it was who set it up should IMO write something for CompassSport or Focus explaining how it works and stress some sort of consistency.
I understand some regions still use their version of the old colour-coded scheme which I felt was quite a good one - you earned the standard for 3x either top 1/2 of field or some %age of the winner (150% wasn't it?). The "new" system gives 3 levels of "attainment" and 1 just for completion. This is good in principle but it is based on mins/km which IMO is poor since some parts of the country far more people can do fast mins/km than others for TD5 courses. I think a combo of the old colour-coded and badge event system would work better. So have the same certs as now, but the requirements should be based on relative performances, not absolute. So Gold could be top 25% of field or 125% of the winner's time, Silver could be top 50% or 150%, etc
JK
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Re: British Orienteering Incentive Scheme
JK wrote:So, yes - whoever it is in BOF, or whoever it was who set it up should IMO write something for CompassSport or Focus explaining how it works and stress some sort of consistency
Yup, totally agree. We're good at keeping secrets in orienteering.
I don't have any issue with the simplicity of the scheme. One of our Achilles heels in this sport is that we have a habit of complicating things which does make some people glaze over. Yes the criteria are a bit noddy. It makes the gold awards very achievable but isn't this what we want at this level?
I hope clubs that are hearing about the scheme for the first time on here will start promoting it to their members - once it's fixed.
- Sunlit Forres
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Re: British Orienteering Incentive Scheme
Sunlit Forres wrote:I don't have any issue with the simplicity of the scheme. One of our Achilles heels in this sport is that we have a habit of complicating things which does make some people glaze over. Yes the criteria are a bit noddy. It makes the gold awards very achievable but isn't this what we want at this level?
I hope clubs that are hearing about the scheme for the first time on here will start promoting it to their members - once it's fixed.
Well I'd heard that the mins/km meant it was easily achievable in some parts of UK and very hard in others.
And no-one should be hearing about it here for the first time. I'm sure it was mentioned in one of Focus, Compasssport, Nopesport or Mike's emails about how clubs needed to be putting their level D results up on the BOF website (and indeed many are now doing that), but I don't recall ever seeing the requirements for naming - that certainly needs clarifying. Note that examples I gave above weren't finger pointing, I think they are fairly typical rather than isolated cases. Also if you have an event with age groups and colout coded on the same course then having course numbers makes sense and I suspect that it then isn't trivial to upload results accordingly.
JK
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