I don't like relays. Again this year I'm going to pack up after day 3 of the JK and go home.
It's a matter of personal preference, but I can't be the only one. My rough count of the number of runners at JK 2016:
day 1: 2036
day 2: 2450
day 3: 2413
day 4: 1476
Isn't that a glaring missed opportunity? Nearly 1000 orienteers had made a journey to the JK weekend, but not been tempted to part with some cash and enter a race on day 4. I'm not suggesting the relays be dropped, but why not try something else along side to attract these people to an event on day 4? E.g. run an individual race, a level B maybe, in parallel with the relays.
More participation at our flagship festival and, probably more importantly, extra revenue for the sport...
Discuss!
JK day 4
Moderators: [nope] cartel, team nopesport
30 posts
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Re: JK day 4
So what is it that the 1000 people don't like about the relay? No team? Don't like the pressure?
The relays are definitely different but I personally think they have the best spectator atmosphere.
The relays are definitely different but I personally think they have the best spectator atmosphere.
- peteT
- white
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Re: JK day 4
My reason is after 3 days of good quality orienteering, £16 per competitor is too much for perhaps a 3 - 4 km leg. I'd rather spend my money elsewhere.
- DavidHH
- off string
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Re: JK day 4
I'm only going for the relay.
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mharky - team nopesport
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Re: JK day 4
I'm only going to watch mharky in the relay...
It is a good question, when jukola 25manna and tiomila
are the big club mass participation events of the year,
why can't we make our relays popular?
I think it's to do with format. With so many tiny classes,
lots of people are dispiritingly off the back and it's hard
to build teams. At jukola the challenge to get in the top X
hundred is real for everyone.
It is a good question, when jukola 25manna and tiomila
are the big club mass participation events of the year,
why can't we make our relays popular?
I think it's to do with format. With so many tiny classes,
lots of people are dispiritingly off the back and it's hard
to build teams. At jukola the challenge to get in the top X
hundred is real for everyone.
WOC2024 Edinburgh
Test races at SprintScotland (Alloa/Falkirk) and Euromeeting (near Stirling).
Test races at SprintScotland (Alloa/Falkirk) and Euromeeting (near Stirling).
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graeme - god
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Re: JK day 4
The recent BO participant survey said something about very few orienteers doing it for the competition. 2 or 3 % I think it was. I suspect the competitive nature of relays puts a lot of people off. I know a few people who keep away from relays as they're worried about letting the team down.
Personally I think team events, in whatever form, are the best form of orienteering there is.
Personally I think team events, in whatever form, are the best form of orienteering there is.
- Sunlit Forres
- diehard
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Re: JK day 4
I am one of the 1000 relay boycotters.
For me it's the fact that UK relays are "fast and furious", usually short, easy, lots of controls and very fast. Whereas my orienteering style is the opposite, slow and steady but no mistakes even in difficult terrain.
So I love Jukola for that reason - you can go slow and steady and still come in the top 200 with a clean run. Plus the night legs amplify all that once again.
For me it's the fact that UK relays are "fast and furious", usually short, easy, lots of controls and very fast. Whereas my orienteering style is the opposite, slow and steady but no mistakes even in difficult terrain.
So I love Jukola for that reason - you can go slow and steady and still come in the top 200 with a clean run. Plus the night legs amplify all that once again.
- Arnold
- diehard
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Re: JK day 4
On several occasions at both the JK and BOC I have only run the relays.......and I have displayed proudly on my mantelpiece a BOC gold medal as a result - I'm never going to win one of those in the individuals!
HOC used to (possibly still do) pay relay entries - would that encourage more people to stay on and give it a go?
HOC used to (possibly still do) pay relay entries - would that encourage more people to stay on and give it a go?
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Mrs H - god
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Re: JK day 4
If I'm at an event, I usually take part in relays, but I hate the "atmosphere".
Crowds, noise, blaring PA systems, other competitors screeching in my ear, stench of burning flesh from the burger vans. And if I'm really unlucky, a big screen flashing images or text to trigger a migraine
Hanging around getting too hot, or freezing cold, or wet, and too thirsty....
Obviously suits some folks, but not my idea of fun, I just want to get on with the course.
However, I'll be really disappointed if our team manager reads this and I don't get a run at the British and Scottish relays!
Crowds, noise, blaring PA systems, other competitors screeching in my ear, stench of burning flesh from the burger vans. And if I'm really unlucky, a big screen flashing images or text to trigger a migraine
Hanging around getting too hot, or freezing cold, or wet, and too thirsty....
Obviously suits some folks, but not my idea of fun, I just want to get on with the course.
However, I'll be really disappointed if our team manager reads this and I don't get a run at the British and Scottish relays!
- Karen
- red
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Re: JK day 4
mharky wrote:I'm only going for the relay.
Good to hear, my club has been heavily promoting the relay to our junior squad such that we have around 10 juniors actually just doing the relay and not the individual days.
BOK/JK relays are more comparable to WOC/JWOC relays than to Jukola/Tio and admittedly are generally fast and often not on the most technical terrain. The M55 planner has test run one of the JK Trophy long laps in 50 mins (without really looking at the map) so the elites will zip round.
For those that do enjoy the atmosphere there are good spectator opportunities, around 10-15 mins after starting the runners can be seen (with binoculars) on an open hillside opposite the arena. Another 5 or so minutes later they will appear back in the arena before heading out on another loop leading to a final run in on more open land next to the arena. For those that hate relays perhaps this is another good reason to stay away - there will be nowhere to hide.
Not wanting to let the team down is the biggest reason I get for not doing relays. With them being so close to home this year I've managed to put 24 teams together but generally only by promising people that they will only be in a "social" team. A few seasoned JK attendees will be losing their major relay virginity on Easter Monday.
It's very difficult to change peoples' perception and to be honest reading some of the comments on this thread I wouldn't want to plan/organise an event that tried to cater for both the relayphiles and the relayphobes. Let the 'philes enjoy their day and let the 'phobes just find something else to do.
- NeilC
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Re: JK day 4
Does the date of Easter have something (perhaps small) to do with this as well? I know that my University starts the Summer Term on the Tuesday after Easter as do several local schools.
- DavidJ
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Re: JK day 4
I think the relays are the most fun day of all.
However, I can't see why we don't just have one Mens, one Womens and one Junior/Novice/lower technical difficulty class. The JK Trophy is already short enough for all competitors to complete it, and there would be a lot more direct competition for all the teams. You could still award medals to different categories if that's what motivates people. Running in a class with only 10 or so other teams isn't really what it's about.
However, I can't see why we don't just have one Mens, one Womens and one Junior/Novice/lower technical difficulty class. The JK Trophy is already short enough for all competitors to complete it, and there would be a lot more direct competition for all the teams. You could still award medals to different categories if that's what motivates people. Running in a class with only 10 or so other teams isn't really what it's about.
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Little Hoddy - green
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Re: JK day 4
I love relays. I love representing my club, I love representing my team and it's the highlight of the British, JK and Scottish for me.
A chance to be competitive and work as a team.
If you don't like relays you're well suited to "B"orienteering.
Here's 5 grid references, take 10p and dig for peanuts at each site until your clothes turn a faded brown, you discover a lapel on your front for storing paperclips and you retain a slight whiff of strangeness.
A chance to be competitive and work as a team.
If you don't like relays you're well suited to "B"orienteering.
Here's 5 grid references, take 10p and dig for peanuts at each site until your clothes turn a faded brown, you discover a lapel on your front for storing paperclips and you retain a slight whiff of strangeness.
From small acorns great Oak trees grow.
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Lard - diehard
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Re: JK day 4
Little Hoddy wrote:Running in a class with only 10 or so other teams isn't really what it's about.
What some people may not realise is that different classes that start at the same time at the JK will be running the same relay (except lap2 for the M/W48-). Thus there will be fields of circa 65 for W Open/M165+, 70 for M Open/M120+, 75 for W Short/W165+/ M/W210+/W48- and 80 for M Short/W120+/M48-.
Not massive numbers but at least twice the size of a WOC relay field and arguably large enough to provide competition for most teams.
- NeilC
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Re: JK day 4
Having just 2 or 3 big classes sounds interesting. Might tempt me to give it a go...
Interesting that no one has agreed with my suggestion to run an individual race in parallel with the relays. It seems to me an easy option.
My broader point is that something's going wrong somewhere if the format of day 4 turns off 40% of us. 40% is a big number. Big enough that it's worth thinking how to attract them.
Interesting that no one has agreed with my suggestion to run an individual race in parallel with the relays. It seems to me an easy option.
My broader point is that something's going wrong somewhere if the format of day 4 turns off 40% of us. 40% is a big number. Big enough that it's worth thinking how to attract them.
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Crex - white
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