Harvester 2012

[Spookster]

A week to go until the Harvester relays, the next round of the UK Relay League.

Entries are down quite a bit on last year. Only 20 teams on A (26 last year) and 26 on B (39 last year). With many of the top teams in the UKRL missing, there are bound to be changes in the league table.

With over 16,000 people running at Jukola/Venla in Finland last weekend, it's a pity we can only manage 260 for the UK equivalent.

[andy]

Perhaps to gain enthusiasm for the harvester we need to include it alongside a major event for a few years.
I want to go to Jukola/Tio Mila purely because of the reputations they have built up, Harvester hasn't got much of a reputation yet and it isn't going to gain any without some extra incentives to get people taking part.

[AndyC]

Do you think the location of the Harvester this year is relevant to a drop in numbers -it is a very long way South (and even further for the Scots). I know my club looked at putting out a team and the distance put most of us off.
What major event do you suggest? - despite it clashing this year with a championship event I'm planning less than 50 miles away - I'd suggest the Compassport Cup Final especially if guest runs for those running the Harvester whose clubs haven't qualified for the final were allowed. Might encourage those clubs who qualify but find the distance to travel for the final an issue if two events were available?

[greywolf]

I'm not sure I entirely agree with Mike Hamilton's characterisation of British O clubs as event organising bodies with no significant social role... but I think the relative lack of interest in the Harvester (cf how important Tiomila and Jukola are for Swedes / Finns) is evidence in his favour...

Still struggling to understand why anyone would organise a "championship" to clash with a Level A event, let alone one 50 miles away...

[Spookster]

Do you think the location of the Harvester this year is relevant to a drop in numbers -it is a very long way South (and even further for the Scots). I know my club looked at putting out a team and the distance put most of us off.

Last year in Sheffield it had one Scottish club (FVO), which had 4 teams. This year it's only FVO again, with just 1 team. So of a reduction of 19 teams, only 3 are due to Scottish club(s). There's a big reduction in English clubs participation, which is disappointing given that the south of England has the highest density of clubs/members.

[King Penguin]

Club Championships Andy ?

Combining with the CSC Final just would not work in my opinion.
Anyone up Saturday night / early Sunday morning for the Harvester is not going to be at their best for the CSC Final on the Sunday. Running the CSC Final first on the Saturday will cause problems for those with long journeys, and leave all doing both events tired for the Harvester.

I thought ShUOC / SYO did a great job last year with a Middle on the Saturday for those that wanted it. There is the option of running at Alice Holt on the Saturday this year, and I think also other options within range on both Sat and Sun for those that want them. Personally I am happy to do a pre-event on the Sat (pref sprint or middle) but I am always too *****ered on the Sunday to do another event - either as a result of running an early leg and then staying up to watch the rest or having only recently finished a later leg.

[AndyC]

Still struggling to understand why anyone would organise a "championship" to clash with a Level A event, let alone one 50 miles away...

So am I but it is the NE Score Championship on Simonside only a level C and CSC is nominally a "closed" event to the qualified clubs -even though this year I believe RR accept guest entries - which circumvents the rules about proximity and I believe it may have been registered first (or it my not have been).
I did suggest moving it to the Saturday (to allow EVO with the CSC) but that is BL's Carlisle Urban Race which is as near (can't win sometimes).

[ifor]

One of the major problems this year for Bok is the clash with the world masters which has a number of regulars missing. We also have our anual local relay event on the Sunday which is also stoping some people attending.

End result is that we have half as many teams at the Harvester as at Jukola. I am of course very happy the event is at least going ahead. It should be a great event and I want to put a few things right on the area after my run there at the southern nights.

I don't think mixing with another major event is a good idea. You can only run well once and the harvester deserves your full atention. Somthing not so serious on the Sataday or Sunday but not somthing like the CSC final. As it is this year I will be doing the British MTBO Sprint champs on the Saturday then the Harvester, unfortunatly they are not realy that close....

[andypat]

Back to the Harvester, its quite a job for smaller clubs to organise a competitive team of that size for Night O. It means for those of us that might like to do it - you cant put it in your diary until the team captain has done his bit. I know I said I'd go if he could rustle up a team this year, but no dice. So off for a nice meeting all day instead!

[Jayne]

I think (correct me if I'm wrong) that teams don't have to be club teams, but can be made up of people from a mix of clubs. This happens a lot at Jukola (the SLOW men running were all on teams made up of different friends/ex uni clubs and ended up with some fun battles).

The technology last year was definitely a massive improvement and very addictive (well done to Shuoc on that) - Not sure what is planned for this year?

The World Masters is also a main cause of us having fewer teams.

Is anyone staying up all night to liveblog

[SeanC]

Looks like this year, according to fabian4, ad hoc/mixed club teams are being entered on the B course rather than A course. This makes sense as it's likely to be just a handful and you might be lucky to find someone up for the 12k day leg or 9k night leg in a handful of orienteers (given the ageing sport profile).

Definately if clubs have ones and twos who want to run it's worth contacting the organiser.

Looking forward to the event and hope my team hits its annual Harvester target (not coming last )

[NickC]

I prefer the relay system in France. One annual club relay: Premier division 30 teams of 8 (mixed with one (at least) night leg. Second division 40 teams by 8; 3rd division 50 x 7 and 4th division y teams (this year 94) x 7. There is also a 4 person relay to allow others to run. This year it was on Sunday with the French middle championships on the Saturday afternoon.
Atmosphere generated is incredible. Promotion and regulation between divisions, clubs can only have one team in each of division 1 to 3.
We also have a 7 man (with night leg) relay and 4 lady relay in the Autumn.
The other club competition is the Coupe de France but this is calculated on ranking points awarded throughout the year at regionale events - more runners attend, more points. We have a very enthusiastic club secretary who names and shames in the weekly newsletter those running "wrong" courses or who need to do their minimum number (4) or counting events.

[haloite]

Why not add a "Venla" relay? I'm guessing there are quite afew clubs who probably don't have any "night-O" enthusiasts - give them a day-time alternative, as Venla, on the afternoon of the main event? Same format as the current "B" but in the day - but still have the "A" and "B" Night Harvester??

[awk]

A purely personal perspective, and one that I know a lot here won't subscribe to, but last year was my first return to the Harvester for a few years. In spite of the fact that I enjoy night orienteering usually, I gave up the Harvester after too many tangles with summer vegetation, and promptly found myself scrabbling round in Eccleshall's brambles and greenery to remind me why I gave it up. I can't say that a Harvester in an even more vegetated south (right or wrong, that's my perception) exactly inspired me, nor that I'll be rushing back as it stands.

Personally, I'm using the summer season more and more as my break from major terrain based events, at least in this country, recharging batteries for the autumn and spring seasons.

[Arnold]

The problem with the Harvester for me is that it's too small especially compared to Jukola. I remember doing it not long after Jukola a few years ago and it was a massive let down to be stood in a field on my own when a few weeks before there were thousands of people.

Staying up all night (or at least running in the middle of the night) for orienteering is a bit of an investment especially if you have kids - takes forever to recover. For the Jukola it's worth it, for the Harvester not so much.