Ripon

[Mrs H]

most enjoyable race in Ripon today - despite the incredible heat. i very much enjoyed my C course which I think took in the best bits.

It was however disappointing to see that people don't understand the meaning of the thick black line as "must not be crossed" even if in reality it is easy to cross. The low wall behind the toilets - which many of us had nipped over before the race was plainly not to be crossed - but one runner waved jauntily to me as they climbed over it completely oblivious of their infringement - even though the red line was carefully routed round it.

No-one would have deliberately broken the rules in full sight of the finish official so it was obviously a case of ignorance not malice.

But what is to be done to stop it happening ?(yes i suppose another control could have been put in the park to pull people towards the gated exit - but should that be necessary?)

[Strider]

Yes, having looked at the B course as well I would concur with you Mrs H. that the better courses were the shorter ones, all of which involved none of the dead running to the west of the map, as the A course did. However, I have symapthy with the planner on this one, as it would have been very tricky to avoid this when the town being used is such a small one!

Re the issue over 'uncrossable' symbols on urban/sprint maps, it is plainly obvious that a good deal of orienteers do not fully understand the regulations related to ISSOM and I'm not sure how you get past this one, when many involved only do occasional events on such maps.

S.

[Fourth]

.

[bac0990]

Not sure I ever agree with the dead running comments, personnally I made my two biggest mistakes directly after that section - mainly because I tried to run those legs faster than I am really capable of.

Is it right to accept ignorance of map symbols as an excuse? I do not think so.

That said, I have had occassions to note somebody doing something wrong when I have been out on a course and thought to myself "Bloke in black leggings wearing xxx club top" with every intention of reporting it. Have I ever reported it - well yes once actually I did and got an extremely cool response from the officials.
Granted, it was a fairly low key local event but how else is this to be controlled unless we police it ourselves?
I have not done it since although I have noted it.

As for the poor finish offical spotting it, not really best placed to see it - if it was even within their remit.

I do not do many of these but enjoyed this very much, thanks CLARO.

[awk]

I thorougly enjoyed the A course today (excepting the heat!). The running round the western end never felt dead, more a section to pick up the pace (something that I was completely incapable of!). I thought there were some excellent route choice legs, and some interesting route finding required at times (especially when at speed). The course was certainly one of the most varied urban races I've done in a while, and ranks well up amongst Nopesport races. Thanks to Claro for a great event.

As for the problem of wall crossings etc. I think the only solution is (a) for reminders in final details and on the start line and (b)for a strict application of the rules when they are broken, inadvertantly or not. And that means officials taking observations of transgressions seriously. Maybe numbers need to be required to assist?

[epocian]

Anyone know if CLARO intend to put the courses on Routegadget?

[Mrs H]

It is hard to actually blow the whistle though isn't it? I've bawled plenty of people out while out on the course but even a XXXX battleaxe like me would find it hard to report someone to officials - it just makes you look like your taking it a bit too seriously doesn't it?

[Spookster]

I enjoyed the A course, though I lost time at various different places for various reasons. The planning made good use of the area, even on the long "dead running" legs.

Anyone know if CLARO intend to put the courses on Routegadget?

CLARO aren't signed up for Routegadget, so probably not.

Results are here, but still have several of us disqualified for missing control 11 on A. In fact it had been stolen/removed, so hopefully those can be corrected.

[madmike]

(yes i suppose another control could have been put in the park to pull people towards the gated exit - but should that be necessary?)

It shouldn't but would have been advisable imho - not everyone knows the ISSOM rules methinks.

Personally, I'd have put a contol there anyway before the road crossing or even had the finish near that gate.

That said it was a really great day - thanks CLARO I really enjoyed it

[Wendles]

A VERY few photos here: http://www.flickr.com/photos/wendles56/sets/72157623997186309/

I too thoroughly enjoyed today's run despite being useless in hot weather. Thankyou to the CLARO team.

[awk]

It shouldn't but would have been advisable imho - not everyone knows the ISSOM rules methinks.

Well, the line was sharply angled to go through the gate, so even if you didn't know, then that should have given you a ruddy great brick of a hint, even if tired at the end of the run. I would still suggest that the way to ensure this is no excuse is to ensure reminders in start lanes and on final details.

[madmike]

awk,
I agree with you - I am not defending the cheaters be they "deliberate" or "inadvertant" cheats.

I actually made an error, which I could have rescued by leaping a wall and running through a car park (mapped olive green) I could actually see the wall that the control was on across the carpark; however, I know the rules, have a modicum of integrity and therefore ran the long way round the OOB - my point is a novice to ISSOM conventions may not have made the same decision and in every sport there is the odd cheater.

It should not be necessary to put in control as Mrs H mentions but unfortunately it is. Notices in start lanes and final details don't "ensure" anything although they do help mitigate the risk. A notice at the last control a la Edinburgh befoire the gardens might help with the accidental cheaters. But by control 23 many of us with limited capacity and in severe oxygen debt may not recall the start lane notice or have memorised the final details (lots of people don't read the final details from cover to cover methinks).

[awk]

I accept and agree with all that Mike, and I do agree that planning needs to try and take things into account, but all I'm saying is that if one has got the notices, and then someone does it wrong, there's no question; one should have known. And there's so much going on in an urban area, that the planner can't cover every base. No system is going to be foolproof - all sports get cheating and inadvertant breaking of rules, and getting away with it too - it's making sure that things are tipped in favour of the law-abiding. it doesn't take many instances of people being caught before the instances of rule-breaking decline dramatically.

[graeme]

it doesn't take many instances of people being caught before the instances of rule-breaking decline dramatically.

Why do you think that? It's over two years since we DQ'ed a third of the field in Edinburgh
http://www.rstrain.ndtilda.co.uk/results_08/euoc/
and I've yet to see this decline.

I don't think it's going to go away. I think it means we shouldn't treat these races too seriously, because the "solution" of compromising the planning for the law-abiding majority is too unpalatable (though putting controls on compulsory but avoidable crossing points seems like a no-brainer).

[AndyC]

Reminded of a Controller a couple of years ago who positioned himself at the wall he thought would be crossed illegally and used a camera to record the offender..
In this instance I'd be inclined to go a little further and arm him with a paintball gun -anyone marked with paint would be DQ'd in the finish lane (and if they removed the paint that would be an effective time penalty -added to the bruise -penalising enough to remove advantage) Yes I know that someone wearing two shirts could remove one but a) in yesterday's heat and b) it would probably soak through...


Edit: Mrs H I take it you'd volunteer for gunner duty -who else?