I know I don't have them, but I don't seem to be tackling them right either - it's a route choice thing. How should I approach them? what are the tricks and tips? Here are two legs from last Sunday - how would you have tackled them?
For the first map, the runnable blocks had been thinned in the last week with extraction lanes and heavy brashings lying North/South in the RH block and aligned with the ride in the LH one.
The second map the runnable looked more light green (but probably wasn't).
Long Legs
Moderators: [nope] cartel, team nopesport
19 posts
• Page 1 of 2 • 1, 2
Long Legs
- Attachments
-
- tunstall6.JPG (61.31 KiB) Viewed 14345 times
-
- tunstall5.JPG (59.29 KiB) Viewed 14345 times
-
PorkyFatBoy - diehard
- Posts: 654
- Joined: Mon Apr 05, 2004 9:13 am
- Location: A contour-free zone
by just looking at the maps - as straight as possible on both.
18-19 - how about the paths to the south? otherwise straightish, aiming off slightly either to the north or the south, and attacking the control via either the small path to the north then down through the depressions, or via the yellow ride to the south of the straight line route and then bash through the light green into the control.
3-4 - if the forest really was as sh*t as it must have been to make you take the route that you did, then as an alternative 'round the paths' option, i would have gone to the south and along the road that goes close to the start, then up either the second or third path to the right (could do with seeing a bit more of the map!) before attacking from the big path junction... however IMHO on areas like this, where its so flat, striaght is often great if you're prepared to bash a bit...
18-19 - how about the paths to the south? otherwise straightish, aiming off slightly either to the north or the south, and attacking the control via either the small path to the north then down through the depressions, or via the yellow ride to the south of the straight line route and then bash through the light green into the control.
3-4 - if the forest really was as sh*t as it must have been to make you take the route that you did, then as an alternative 'round the paths' option, i would have gone to the south and along the road that goes close to the start, then up either the second or third path to the right (could do with seeing a bit more of the map!) before attacking from the big path junction... however IMHO on areas like this, where its so flat, striaght is often great if you're prepared to bash a bit...
-
bendover - addict
- Posts: 1459
- Joined: Sat Nov 08, 2003 5:00 am
- Location: London
I thought your first choice was Ok - might have been worth going up the ride above and blasting through the last bit.
on the second one I would have certainly wanted to cut off the last corner, blasting through from the open to the rough open and then bearing off slightly south to pick up the clearing below the control.
on the second one I would have certainly wanted to cut off the last corner, blasting through from the open to the rough open and then bearing off slightly south to pick up the clearing below the control.
-
Mrs H. - nope godmother
- Posts: 2034
- Joined: Thu Jan 15, 2004 3:15 pm
- Location: Middle England
Mrs H. wrote:... then bearing off slightly south to pick up the clearing below the control.
I think you have just done the leg backwards
I would have tried to go more direct for the first part of the leg, through the white, and then made a decision on how direct for the rest after looking at how easy the stripy stuff was to get through.
-
Simon - brown
- Posts: 532
- Joined: Wed May 19, 2004 7:40 pm
- Location: here or there
I can't really say what I'd have done as it sounds like you needed to be there to appreciate the more "special" elements of the forest! However, when teaching long legs on tour, we always say find your attack point from the control and work backwards from it. Keep it as simple as possible in the body of the leg, you don't want to be map reading constantly and wasting time. Have a really decent attack point that you couldn't miss if you tried and get there as fast as possible. I'm sure it's all advice you've heard before but you did ask!
Will? We've got proper fire now!
-
Becks - god
- Posts: 2633
- Joined: Fri Nov 07, 2003 2:25 pm
- Location: East Preston Street Massif
I think that Becks's general advice is pretty good.
Personally I find that so long as you have a good attack point(I find that there are few things more annoying than pushing a little bit harder than normal on the main part of the leg so gain a few seconds, only to lose them all and more by mising the control at the end) in the end it is not very important what your exact route choice is, so long as it is fairly sensible(since the time difference between routes can often be negligible, so the sooner you start executing the route the lower the amount of time wasted).
With that in mind, my usual plan would be to go as straight as possible, ignoring any climb that is on the route(unless there is an easy/short way to avoid it) and once that is decided(in advance usually) I think that the best thing to do is just get on with it and really attack, so that you don't mess around losing any more time.
hope this helps a little
Personally I find that so long as you have a good attack point(I find that there are few things more annoying than pushing a little bit harder than normal on the main part of the leg so gain a few seconds, only to lose them all and more by mising the control at the end) in the end it is not very important what your exact route choice is, so long as it is fairly sensible(since the time difference between routes can often be negligible, so the sooner you start executing the route the lower the amount of time wasted).
With that in mind, my usual plan would be to go as straight as possible, ignoring any climb that is on the route(unless there is an easy/short way to avoid it) and once that is decided(in advance usually) I think that the best thing to do is just get on with it and really attack, so that you don't mess around losing any more time.
hope this helps a little
-
David - white
- Posts: 57
- Joined: Fri Dec 19, 2003 3:47 pm
- Location: I am: In my mind... and in reality...
I think what is especially important on long legs, especially onnes which are more technical than those two, is once youu have decided your routee, do it and do it well, even if it may be slower if its donne with no time loss then that is perfect. route choise sometimes comese dowwn to luck.
I wouldnt choose the route that is necesarily the easiest, i would choosee the rouute that i think would be quickest for me. its important toto realisee that some are better on hills, some fast on paths, some tough through terrain use your strengths to get the best ouut of your performance.
I wouldnt choose the route that is necesarily the easiest, i would choosee the rouute that i think would be quickest for me. its important toto realisee that some are better on hills, some fast on paths, some tough through terrain use your strengths to get the best ouut of your performance.
-
mharky - team nopesport
- Posts: 4541
- Joined: Fri Oct 24, 2003 3:39 pm
Thanks for all your advice. I did try and "love my route", but I did stop return her phone calls shortly afterwards.
On 18-19 I did try and get the wide ride, (but missed) and I suppose that my eye was drawn to the route I took initially as I'd been there on 13-14.
On 3-4 I was only one row of trees out from the control, but had fought through the undergrowth to get there loosing minutes and gaining scars.
I only thought I'd ask becuase these were the legs where I'd lost 5-6mins each over the fastest runner and they happened to be the long legs. Maybe I'm just not strong enough yet and still inexperienced in terrain. Despite this I still made par on the Brown course for the first time ever
I think the key things I've learned is to keep it simple in between, keep it straingt as possible and to keep attacking. I find it easy to slack off and dither about the route choice (whether it was the right one etc), particularly if there is no-one else around.
Plenty of opportunity to practice this weekend with two M40L badge events at the Thetford Thrash.
On 18-19 I did try and get the wide ride, (but missed) and I suppose that my eye was drawn to the route I took initially as I'd been there on 13-14.
On 3-4 I was only one row of trees out from the control, but had fought through the undergrowth to get there loosing minutes and gaining scars.
I only thought I'd ask becuase these were the legs where I'd lost 5-6mins each over the fastest runner and they happened to be the long legs. Maybe I'm just not strong enough yet and still inexperienced in terrain. Despite this I still made par on the Brown course for the first time ever
I think the key things I've learned is to keep it simple in between, keep it straingt as possible and to keep attacking. I find it easy to slack off and dither about the route choice (whether it was the right one etc), particularly if there is no-one else around.
Plenty of opportunity to practice this weekend with two M40L badge events at the Thetford Thrash.
-
PorkyFatBoy - diehard
- Posts: 654
- Joined: Mon Apr 05, 2004 9:13 am
- Location: A contour-free zone
Yup, on the losing out timewise thing I'd say Mharky's advice was tip top - whatever decision you make, stick to it and go for it. Long legs are a chance to really push your running. I had one at the weekend where I pretended it was a five minute interval with the XC club in my head and that the girl who's usually just in front was just in front. Was exhausted by the time I reached the control but only 30 secs down on the fastest split, when normally I'm a couple of mins down at least. It's all about beasting it.
Will? We've got proper fire now!
-
Becks - god
- Posts: 2633
- Joined: Fri Nov 07, 2003 2:25 pm
- Location: East Preston Street Massif
Becks wrote:Yup, on the losing out timewise thing I'd say Mharky's advice was tip top - whatever decision you make, stick to it and go for it. Long legs are a chance to really push your running. I had one at the weekend where I pretended it was a five minute interval with the XC club in my head and that the girl who's usually just in front was just in front. Was exhausted by the time I reached the control but only 30 secs down on the fastest split, when normally I'm a couple of mins down at least. It's all about beasting it.
Total bollacks......so do a Becks... arive at the end of a long leg totally shafted & hope you find the controls.. but you don't ..so you waste time... are into oxygen debt & screw the next control....better to BE IN CONTROL all the way throughh... then check the splits
- gross2004
have to agree. let the running take care of itself. just navigate. save the 'beasting it' for the run in.
-
bendover - addict
- Posts: 1459
- Joined: Sat Nov 08, 2003 5:00 am
- Location: London
gross2004 wrote:Becks wrote:Yup, on the losing out timewise thing I'd say Mharky's advice was tip top - whatever decision you make, stick to it and go for it. Long legs are a chance to really push your running. I had one at the weekend where I pretended it was a five minute interval with the XC club in my head and that the girl who's usually just in front was just in front. Was exhausted by the time I reached the control but only 30 secs down on the fastest split, when normally I'm a couple of mins down at least. It's all about beasting it.
Total bollacks......so do a Becks... arive at the end of a long leg totally shafted & hope you find the controls.. but you don't ..so you waste time... are into oxygen debt & screw the next control....better to BE IN CONTROL all the way throughh... then check the splits
I spiked the control rather nicely actually Gross. But I do see your point. I am practising pushing myself into that kind of zone at the moment so maybe it's not the bnest all round advice.
Will? We've got proper fire now!
-
Becks - god
- Posts: 2633
- Joined: Fri Nov 07, 2003 2:25 pm
- Location: East Preston Street Massif
if you know what your doing exactly then you can speen up, but whats the poinint of being knackered before you have finished. when i get to a track i push it, but i dont pretend its a meadows intervals coz at the end of them i have to stop for a few mins.
I hope youu don't give juniors this typee of advice
I hope youu don't give juniors this typee of advice
-
mharky - team nopesport
- Posts: 4541
- Joined: Fri Oct 24, 2003 3:39 pm
I like Becks' attitude.
Why not do this sort of thing in low key events ?
Find out how hard you can push and still be in control, still find the flag.
Explore your limits.
sure, you don't do random intervals in a race that counts.
But Becks is right - you have to beast it on a long leg during the inevitable dead navigation sections.
You traffic light.
On the green section run hard - at the limit of your physical steady state
Amber ease up - some recovery as you slow to navigate.
Red - ease right back into the control and punch - a brief respite - good recovery.
You need to be in control to ensure you execute the traffic lighting.
For the Edinburgh crew - this is why you get short recoveries on your intervals - you get short recoveries in an O' race
I'd say ideally you want to be shafted before you finish your RACE - say by 95% distance. If it is going well then you will find the drive to race on to the finish and achieve your absolute best time.
Better this than finishing a RACE with a physical reserve -
sometimes you can miss out on WOC if you do that....!
Why not do this sort of thing in low key events ?
Find out how hard you can push and still be in control, still find the flag.
Explore your limits.
sure, you don't do random intervals in a race that counts.
But Becks is right - you have to beast it on a long leg during the inevitable dead navigation sections.
You traffic light.
On the green section run hard - at the limit of your physical steady state
Amber ease up - some recovery as you slow to navigate.
Red - ease right back into the control and punch - a brief respite - good recovery.
You need to be in control to ensure you execute the traffic lighting.
For the Edinburgh crew - this is why you get short recoveries on your intervals - you get short recoveries in an O' race
I'd say ideally you want to be shafted before you finish your RACE - say by 95% distance. If it is going well then you will find the drive to race on to the finish and achieve your absolute best time.
Better this than finishing a RACE with a physical reserve -
sometimes you can miss out on WOC if you do that....!
If you could run forever ......
-
Kitch - god
- Posts: 2433
- Joined: Wed Feb 11, 2004 2:09 pm
- Location: embada
19 posts
• Page 1 of 2 • 1, 2
Who is online
Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 23 guests