Lots of kids between 9 and 15 try orienteering - in my school and many others just about 100% will have tried a course as part of a trip to an outdoors centre, an after school activity etc.. My experience is that almost all of them enjoy it - the sporty ones like running about, the intellectuals enjoy the brainwork and the slightly naughtly ones like being able to crash through undergrowth and pretending to be Rambo! Almost none of these people will ever go to an orienteering event again - why?
There are probably lots of reasons, but one obvious one is access. You can only get to events if Mum/Dad will take you. Events are spread out over wide areas so it is quite a chore for Mum or Dad unless they want to take part themselves. I have seen lots of kids who manage to pester parent(s) to take them to events a few times but who then drop out because parents have other priorities. Where parents try and like O, things are often great - but another "family" junior for the club, nothing wrong with that but not a genuinely new recruit.
I have been trying to overcome this by taking a minibus from school to events. One slight obstacle is that if I take students I am responsible, so it is hard for me to run in case I am needed - especially as they are mostly doing yellow and running green takes me ages at the moment, so there can be a group of 12 year olds hanging around waiting - not good! I am trying to recruit some more staff and maybe sixth formers to come so we can always have someone from school around the start-finish area. this means I have to get several people committed, though, not just me.
I wonder if anyone has any other approaches to share? - I think a lot of kids would do more O if they did not have to rely on parents so much to take part.
Getting new juniors involved
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Try getting some of the local orienteers along on the trips, and then getting split starts. With another adult there, it is often less intimidating to let the kids go.
Now, I know you're a feminist, and I think that's adorable, but this is grown-up time and I'm the man.
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Braddie - light green
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My experience is that almost all of them enjoy it
whenever I mention that I go orienteering to people my age, their response is usually...oh yeah, we did that at ... and it was really boring.
good for you that you're getting kids to events though
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helen - junior moderator
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The response that helen gets when she mentions orienteering to non-orienteers is the same as the response i often get when i mention orienteering. i think part of the problem is that often outdoors centers sometimes give a missleading view of what orienteering actually is. The last time i tried orienteering at an activity center it was a 10 minute treasure hunt around a field with a map, and most people just sat around doing nothing so it gave loads of people gained the opinion that "it was really boring".
i think though that if the first time you orienteer you really enjoy it then you'll be keen to carry on, as long as there is a good local league taking place in your area, such as a schools league, so parents don't feel to pressurised to get up at 6am to drag their kids half way across the country. However i've found that when meantion orienteering to a lot of teanages that you get up early on a sunday morning for a 5km run most of them look at you like your crazy or something, perhaps local clubs should run more evening events, which may encourage juniors who are not so keen to miss their sunday morning lie-in.
i think though that if the first time you orienteer you really enjoy it then you'll be keen to carry on, as long as there is a good local league taking place in your area, such as a schools league, so parents don't feel to pressurised to get up at 6am to drag their kids half way across the country. However i've found that when meantion orienteering to a lot of teanages that you get up early on a sunday morning for a 5km run most of them look at you like your crazy or something, perhaps local clubs should run more evening events, which may encourage juniors who are not so keen to miss their sunday morning lie-in.
- Nicky
- string
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Some activities centres run "joke orienteering" because they are so safety conscious. Fifteen minutes round a field where you can see all the controls and other kids does not count!
I remember a centre doing one for a group I was with in the Kielder Forest - almost the other extreme - I had visions of kids never being seen again!
I wonder what potential street-O might have for newcomers? Town centre events in summer evenings would be accessible and could be made very "youth friendly".
I remember a centre doing one for a group I was with in the Kielder Forest - almost the other extreme - I had visions of kids never being seen again!
I wonder what potential street-O might have for newcomers? Town centre events in summer evenings would be accessible and could be made very "youth friendly".
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chrisecurtis - red
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even more frustrating Catch 22 here. Well-established city multi-sports club welcomes O club to join up and bring O into community.Potential deal is we say what we can commit to as beginners' course and beyond and guarantee our club working towards/has gained Clubmark accreditation.
They offer notification of O initiative to 10,000 people on their database, may get 100 interested, we say how many we can handle. Premises (with mapped school area) free.Though aimed mostly at kids, experience of other sports clubs there already suggests that families get involved too. Use of minibus free, potential to get minibus driving qualification, support from local development team to run extra instructor courses to train up coaches. Potential for coaches to be paid. Great potential for connecting to development of City park O and regeneration of permanent courses.
What's the hitch (es)?. Well, Clubmark commits club to 30h junior coaching per year, which, with other established regional O coaching, takes up most of this (employed elswhere, plus have own family) club coach's time. Other qualified coaches in club are spread out over area of several hundred square km, and also committed to "club" coaching already. Deal is only on if we're Clubmark accredited, and can staff this with appropriately qualified coaches.....Also low key events to take these developing O stars to are mostly currently out in countryside areas 20 to 30 miles away.
Basic problem obvious; not enough people trained (plus having time) to take this luscious opportunity. Meanwhile other local sports clubs rejuvenated by link to this site, with junior teams flourishing where none before
.
Nil desperandum, am going down there today for further talks, and we have a BOF appointed RDO with multi-sports club experience about to take up post.........Are you still following this (not sure that I am!) Follow continuing saga on these pages........and send re-inforcements of battalions of coaches in this direction.
They offer notification of O initiative to 10,000 people on their database, may get 100 interested, we say how many we can handle. Premises (with mapped school area) free.Though aimed mostly at kids, experience of other sports clubs there already suggests that families get involved too. Use of minibus free, potential to get minibus driving qualification, support from local development team to run extra instructor courses to train up coaches. Potential for coaches to be paid. Great potential for connecting to development of City park O and regeneration of permanent courses.
What's the hitch (es)?. Well, Clubmark commits club to 30h junior coaching per year, which, with other established regional O coaching, takes up most of this (employed elswhere, plus have own family) club coach's time. Other qualified coaches in club are spread out over area of several hundred square km, and also committed to "club" coaching already. Deal is only on if we're Clubmark accredited, and can staff this with appropriately qualified coaches.....Also low key events to take these developing O stars to are mostly currently out in countryside areas 20 to 30 miles away.
Basic problem obvious; not enough people trained (plus having time) to take this luscious opportunity. Meanwhile other local sports clubs rejuvenated by link to this site, with junior teams flourishing where none before
.
Nil desperandum, am going down there today for further talks, and we have a BOF appointed RDO with multi-sports club experience about to take up post.........Are you still following this (not sure that I am!) Follow continuing saga on these pages........and send re-inforcements of battalions of coaches in this direction.
- ifititches
- blue
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not many people do Rob, not many people do (but some of it's been in the club minutes, and has been discussed with BOF people)
They'd even subsidise running of coaching courses/qualifications,but only if those thus trained would commit to using their skills there. Just been down there; teeming with kids who've been doing basketball, cricket, football, golf, gymnastics and fencing with coaches from local clubs.Tennis, netball and badminton come in at weekends Yes , you'd still have problems that some couldn't get out to the sort of mainstream O events we're used to, but that's where the park O might come into its own.Similar stuff must be happening all over UK (or England at least)
They'd even subsidise running of coaching courses/qualifications,but only if those thus trained would commit to using their skills there. Just been down there; teeming with kids who've been doing basketball, cricket, football, golf, gymnastics and fencing with coaches from local clubs.Tennis, netball and badminton come in at weekends Yes , you'd still have problems that some couldn't get out to the sort of mainstream O events we're used to, but that's where the park O might come into its own.Similar stuff must be happening all over UK (or England at least)
- ifititches
- blue
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Chris,
in responce to your first posting have you (or your club) tried to include parents/gardians on the minibus or any coaching you do with the juniors. I suspect a parent that enjoys orienteering like their kids do, would be more willing to take them along or help you on the minibus.
Slight variation on topic nothing really to do with above (read mis-guided bumbling).
Why does all coaching (well most of it) have to be based on the juniors? Surely if coaching was at local/club level was based on the family you might have a better chance of retaining orienteers.
Being an adult does not mean you can naturally orienteer any better than a junior, yet a lot of clubs tend to miss out coaching/encouraging older members who might want to do a bit better than 2 hours round a light green course.
phew rambling over
in responce to your first posting have you (or your club) tried to include parents/gardians on the minibus or any coaching you do with the juniors. I suspect a parent that enjoys orienteering like their kids do, would be more willing to take them along or help you on the minibus.
Slight variation on topic nothing really to do with above (read mis-guided bumbling).
Why does all coaching (well most of it) have to be based on the juniors? Surely if coaching was at local/club level was based on the family you might have a better chance of retaining orienteers.
Being an adult does not mean you can naturally orienteer any better than a junior, yet a lot of clubs tend to miss out coaching/encouraging older members who might want to do a bit better than 2 hours round a light green course.
phew rambling over
- Seamus
- red
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Why does all coaching (well most of it) have to be based on the juniors? Surely if coaching was at local/club level was based on the family you might have a better chance of retaining orienteers.
In my case, very simply because every time I've run sessions aimed mainly at seniors, I've had virtually zero response.
The sessions we run for the club are advertised to all club members. Seniors have been encouraged to come along. Response: zero.
We do get interest when running club weekends in the Lakes or somewhere "interesting", but it seems (from anecdotal experience, even if quite a lot of it) that adults aren't interested in coaching/training/instruction locally. It might explain why so few ever improve much.
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awk - god
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couldn't agree more Seamus. Am going to try experimenting with inviting adults to participate alongside the junior coaching sessions this autumn (they've always been allowed to participate, but very few have) But I've come to the conclusion that, at present, I can't do sessions for adults separately, in addition to the 30 hours plus of junior coaching. And Clubmark is about juniors.
Lots of O clubs do do more for adults though, especially new members.And the multi-sports club clearly brings adult participants into clubs too, and allows them to train as instructors
Entire clubs can avail themselves of the BOF coaching days, if they've got a club coach willing to sign up to go and organise them around what's been set out. There's one in October in the Lakes I think. If I didn't work then I'd always like to have tried running personal performance weekends for adults who want to improve. National O centre does them, but it's too far unless you're spending more thanW/E up there.
In 1974 I went to a BOF open access 4 day course at Bisham Abbey. It was brilliant. Had never got much in the way of results before that, but the letter I got from a selector 4 weeks later has now become part of the folk-lore of my family... I don't need much convincing that adults benefit from coaching too.
Lots of O clubs do do more for adults though, especially new members.And the multi-sports club clearly brings adult participants into clubs too, and allows them to train as instructors
Entire clubs can avail themselves of the BOF coaching days, if they've got a club coach willing to sign up to go and organise them around what's been set out. There's one in October in the Lakes I think. If I didn't work then I'd always like to have tried running personal performance weekends for adults who want to improve. National O centre does them, but it's too far unless you're spending more thanW/E up there.
In 1974 I went to a BOF open access 4 day course at Bisham Abbey. It was brilliant. Had never got much in the way of results before that, but the letter I got from a selector 4 weeks later has now become part of the folk-lore of my family... I don't need much convincing that adults benefit from coaching too.
- ifititches
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I would love to receive some coaching but I think the dilemma for most seniors is this. You have a fixed amount of time to give to your orienteering and it is probably not enough anyway. Are you going to get out there and do an event or do a training exercise instead? You might do some serious training if you had a clear competitive objective, but someone (like me) who took up the sport "seriously" in his mid-40s knows that winning the very occasional club event would be a major achievement and is still some way away, so you get out in the woods and are happy to come a little nearer the middle of the table than you did last time, as long as you are enjoying yourself.
I think SO have a very good idea in response to this dilemma - each of their summer evening series IS a training event (e.g. a map memory exercise) - these are quite well attended (though I could not make any this year).
One last point - I recognise the issues over things like "club-mark". I am dealing with a similar "SportEngland" catch 22 at work. If we want a big pile of money that we desperately need we will have to do a series of things that will cost more than the money we will receive. I see local clubs that need it most missing out on lots of initiatives because they do not have the resources to meet the criteria while the already rich and successful sports clubs have more grants than they know what to do with!
I think SO have a very good idea in response to this dilemma - each of their summer evening series IS a training event (e.g. a map memory exercise) - these are quite well attended (though I could not make any this year).
One last point - I recognise the issues over things like "club-mark". I am dealing with a similar "SportEngland" catch 22 at work. If we want a big pile of money that we desperately need we will have to do a series of things that will cost more than the money we will receive. I see local clubs that need it most missing out on lots of initiatives because they do not have the resources to meet the criteria while the already rich and successful sports clubs have more grants than they know what to do with!
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chrisecurtis - red
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I have looked at using parents or "other adults" to come when I take students to O events. One or two might but...
1. They have to be criminal record checked - costs around £50 and makes innocent people nervous - thankfully a few already have been checked through their job or other roles
2. They worry about the responsibility - vaguely "coming along to help" is fine but enthusiasm tends to go when you explain that there is a rota and a responsible adult must be available by the minibus all morning - they then start asking those "what if..." questions and worry themselves out of the role.
3. The county is twitchy about it. I have to "ensure that anyone placed in a position of responsibility" has "received adequate training and preparation" - which seems to imply a bit more than letting themselves be persuaded to come along. I have had brilliant help from parents who are Police Officers, Nurses etc. (who I regard as "trained") but these are particularly busy people.
I have had some success in over-filling the bus and "persuading" some parents to drive their child and his/her friends to an event. They then have no "official" school role but are usually perfectly happy (and able) to "be around just in case something happens".
1. They have to be criminal record checked - costs around £50 and makes innocent people nervous - thankfully a few already have been checked through their job or other roles
2. They worry about the responsibility - vaguely "coming along to help" is fine but enthusiasm tends to go when you explain that there is a rota and a responsible adult must be available by the minibus all morning - they then start asking those "what if..." questions and worry themselves out of the role.
3. The county is twitchy about it. I have to "ensure that anyone placed in a position of responsibility" has "received adequate training and preparation" - which seems to imply a bit more than letting themselves be persuaded to come along. I have had brilliant help from parents who are Police Officers, Nurses etc. (who I regard as "trained") but these are particularly busy people.
I have had some success in over-filling the bus and "persuading" some parents to drive their child and his/her friends to an event. They then have no "official" school role but are usually perfectly happy (and able) to "be around just in case something happens".
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chrisecurtis - red
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