Orienteering is a cheap sport?

[LostAgain]

I object to the view elsewhere on this thread that Orienteering is a cheap sport.

We as a family orienteer most weekends and this costs us between £50 and £200/week. I do not think this is cheap. This is the variable cost. This works out between £200 - £1000/month. Clearly a £1K being the exception but I'm guessing they'll be 2 months this year which will be around this mark.

If you include the fixed costs of equipment then you can add a further £2/week for the individual.

How does this become a cheap family sport?
Football every Sunday would be certainly less expensive, so would Judo and Swimming. We compete against these sports, not Adventure Racing.

Please come back to the real world!

[NFKleanne]

depends wot level you are participating at. the 6 (sometimes 7) of us, my nephew and my stepdaughters boyfriend all go to out local monthly meets and it costs £10 for entries. this will go up when they run individually, but its still a reasonable cost, and as i've sed in a previous thread we make a day of it, picnic and something in the afternoon. Its ceratinly cheaper than swimming or an hours badminton (10per hour per court)

[egocentric pothunter]

Bethecar Moor £16
Deisel £20
Thermal Top £10 20 years ago (50p a year 5p a race don't wear it in summer)
O Shoes £40 JK Ilkley have run 80 races probably (50p a race)
Lycra Tights £10 10 years ago (£1 a year 5p a race)
Club Top £40 4 years ago (£ 10 a year 20 p a race ish)
Hilly socks £5 10 months ago used for MTB and fell running 10p a race?
Buff £10 18 months ago don't usually runn in it so not included.
Compass £25 5 years ago £5 year 10p a race.
Whistle ?
multiplied by 3

Total cost of
£37 averaging £12.33 each

I'm not including cost of running car cos have to do that any way.

ORIENTEERING? Priceless!

Seriously though I could see a larger commited family with a couple of talented Squad juniors, costs could mount up.

When I did my first event in 1979 in Maulden Woods, I paid school 20p for petrol money and no more that 50p for entry to a colour coded event. I borrowed a compass from either school or WAOC. I wonder what that would be in equivalent money?

[awk]

I'm not including cost of running car cos have to do that any way.

Only not relevant if you walk/cycle/public transport to events,and never use car park at events.

If you only orienteer locally, then O probably isn't that expensive (although it's not particularly cheap either). However, if you aspire to compete beyond that, the costs mount up dramatically, especially when a family. I certainly get through a lot more kit than you do as well EP, and son gets through a LOT more (in his case it's called growing!). We obviously tend to buy more expensive equipment than you - the compass I use costs closer to £50 (and I manage to break them), magnifiers break more often, the shoes are closer to £80 (rubber studs just don't work for me), don't just use one set of equipment (multi-days would get awfully smelly!), also enjoy night orienteering, try to do some training for orienteering, travel more by car (even when local), bought a fast SI card, occasionally (!) go for weekends, and so on and so on.

[Gross]

Great orienteering in Vilnius in season twice a week... all accessible by public bus (75p return). Entry fees about 3 pounds. I'm still using free kit so no cost there.... shoes I got discount on

It is a cheap sport........

[madmike]

Answer is it depends:

2 illustrations of my point:

1. The BAOC mid-week league with my own e-card costs a mere £2

2. I have just paid for my flts, accommodation and hire care for WMOC2009/Aussie East Coast and that has cost over £2200 and I still haven't counted entry fees, affilation fees, food etc.

Therefore, if you want cheap orienteering you can nearly always find it. If you are a world-travelling fanatic it can cost you the GDP of a small West African country each year.

I think what I have drawn most from the discussions on cost is the pressures on families of 4 and more with competitive kids who "have" to go to the big events Not sure what we can do about it though

[Mrs H]

Yes you are right Mike - Orienteering is both a cheap and an expensive sport - I've done the family of 5 flying up to selection races in Scotland thing - and it's been expensive - but it also been great fun and i've always tried to make more of it as a weekend away than just the orienteering. this part is a bit like ski-ing - is it a sport or is it a holiday? if it's both as I believe then it's probably going to cost twice as much as either. You do after all have a choice. and if it's any consolation Lost Again, seeing what sort of people my children have grown up to be i will give the sport the benefit of the doubt and say it's been worth every penny.

Now I mostly do cheap local orienteering and save my pennies for the big multi-days - but even here I always look for the Extra Value (EVO) to make it that bit more worth while.

[roadrunner]

I think you can look at it either way. Compared to a road or XC race, an orienteering event of similar standard is probably cheaper - for example, local XC league events cost £2, same as army midweek orienteering, London Marathon £28 which is more than BOC. The main differences are that most runners don't expect to race every week, and in general the whole family won't be taking part. So I suppose one answer is that, viewed as a competitive sport, orienteering is fairly cheap, but viewed as a weekly family sporting activity, it isn't.

[epocian]

Suggest Lost Again looks at Road races entry fees if LA thinks O fees are steep

Here's a few from next couple of weeks
Fulwood 5k £7 (about 20 mins effort that's £21 per hour!)
Liuversedge half marathon £10
Village Bakery half marathon £9
Wombwell 5 miles £9
Snake Lane 10 ml £10
Gt North West half marathon £17

Still think orienteering is a relatively cheap sport

Would like to see LA's breakdown of £200 per week

[awk]

Suggest Lost Again looks at Road races entry fees if LA thinks O fees are steep

IMO this is a common mistake that a lot of people make. Lost Again is talking about the sport from a family perspective. Road races are not (largely) done by families - they are very much a part of adult sport. The regular quoting of things like adventure racing is a complete irrelevance. Yes, they may be the competing sports when dealing with M/W21s, but not when dealing with families. The options for cheap sport for children are great. Most of my children at school pay virtually nothing for their sport: football match fees are a couple of pounds, the last few cross-country races have cost me zero pounds to enter my teams, table-tennis fees are a pound a session, and so on and so on. And they are all very close to home!

I personally feel that orienteering, generally, is excellent value as a sport, some of the benefits as pointed out by Mrs H being hidden but important (even commented on by offspring's teachers, so not just an orienteering fan's bias), but I do feel it is a mistake to describe it as cheap, and it does the sport no favours to try and describe it so.

Would like to see LA's breakdown of £200 per week

That is LA's top end figure: he says £50-£200.

Visit to a regional event 40 miles away for a family of 4:

Entries: £24 Travel: £11, Wear and tear on kit (estimate): £5
Total = £44

Visit to British Champs Weekend in February:
Entries: £84, Travel: £119, Accommodation: £70, Wear and tear on kit (estimate): £10
Total = £283 before allowing for things like extra food costs.

I think I've been very conservative on costs, especially as there's nothing in there for memberships, costs of squad weekends, training kit etc etc. Wear and tear will be on the low side if my experience of growing children is anything to go by. This is simply a very bare bones figure (BTW travel is based on AA running costs - 23p per mile - plus allowance for car park).

Whether one regards LA's figures to be realistic for an active family, I 'll leave others to judge. It all depends on how committed familes are. But, again, these figures suggest to me that orienteering is not a cheap sport if one goes beyond the very local (which most people have to do if any sort of competitive aspirations).

[LostAgain]

As I said in my original posting, there are more expensive sports. However, elsewhere on this forum and even in some of the replies there is a reference to Orienteering being a cheap sport. This I disagree with and take exception to this.

Yes, I know you can find a CATI or similar and can orienteer almost for free. But this is not what we would call our sport. Going to District Event a couple of weekends and Regional events for the other 2 is what we see as normal. This is supplemented by the more prestigious BOC, JK and Summer Holiday. On top of this we would do SUmmer Leagues and night leagues.

Our equipment costs are far in excess of epocian. I certainly cannot get 80 events out of my shoes and they cost £80+. 6 dibbers for the family £200+. Just upgraded one to a V6 £52! I'm sure he's worth it Makes your eyes water when junior comes back without his SI Card

We have discussed in various threads attendence levels and encouraging families. A rich vein of talent is found in the family groups, from these many of the squad members have risen.

Within our region I see a huge variance between the cost of events put on by different clubs. In YHOA I have to say EPOC is the most family friendly (cost wise) whilst my own club EBOR is the worst. The others lying somewhere inbetween. The difference between a standard DIstrict event is almost double when attending an EBOR event over that of EPOC.

I'm not actually sure that you do get what you pay for. I can honestly say I rarely see a relationship between price and quality other than from a broadbrush. BOC and JK being very expensive and generally the best, whilst local events are entry level and least expensive. The middle ground there is huge interplay, and looks to be even greater with the new format.

[Mrs H]

As I say - I sympathise and can only offer you the long term perspective that whether or not your children make it in the sport i am totally convinced that you as a family and they as individuals will benefit immeasurably from the experience - I founded the whole MADO concept on that passionately held principle.

....and talking of MADO - it seems a pity that you don't have a more competitive local league in your area where you and yours could get good quality cheap sport. Our MADO league is hotly contested by some very fine orienteers as is our neighbouring NGOC Mini-league - this means that usually twice a month we can get a hot fix of the sport for very little cost/travel. Have you thought about organising something like this locally your self?

As for the bigger events - as my dear old dad used to say :"you might as well just pay up and smile" god bless him

[DaveK]

The Kent Night Cup - weekly evening events through the winter months - simple one hour score format and optional (but popular) refreshment at a nearby pub afterwards - has proved really successful. Cost is minimal and sometimes free. Nearly 50 competitors at this week's event in the snow at Mereworth. Seems to suit a range of people - some regular orinteers and some others who seem just to enjoy the format and a bit of adventure.
On the question of cost, junior K has just given me a flier for an 'Iceman' event at Frimley on 21/02 - £20 for a 12k off road run and £43 for the mountain bike duathlon (run 10k / bike 15k / run 10k), though there are prizes on offer. Says it would be a nice birthday treat for me, but not sure who will be paying at those prices!

[SeanC]

I think we can use the c word in our marketing. Granted it might not be cheap for families competing at regional/national level events, but it is pay as you go. Compare orienteering with going to the gym. With a gym you stump up a serious wad up front and it's gone, even if you only go once a month. WIth orienteering you can slowly get into it, and stick as a 5 times a year local runner if you want, which will be cheap. With the credit crunch there will be more and more people quitting gyms and looking for a cheap, accessible alternative. I think we can and should tell these people it's cheap (and much more fun)!

I guess what we should aim for is more areas with competitive local leagues - like the Kent Night Cup, SO league, MADO etc, With more quality local leagues it therefore becomes cheaper for families that want to compete at a good level, but not FCC level.

Edit: One other thought. There is a good case for clubs or regions helping to fund juniors travel and entry costs to FCC/Interland etc races when juniors reach a certain standard. Such grants would also provide marketing and PR opportunities for clubs, but would of course need to be funded through slightly higher entry fees.

[SJ]

Orienteering has been compared against a number of sports in this thread: the "adult sports" of road racing, adventure racing and gym membership and the "kids sports" of football and cross country leagues, swimming etc. It is interesting to note that, with the exception of swimming, these sports are aimed at much narrower age ranges than orienteering, such as school children only or over-18s (and swimming pools often have sessions for adults-only, kids fun-time etc).

So although orienteering may cost a family a lot of money to go to a top event which may require significant travel, it is also important to consider that it can cater for all as there are courses for every age. This means one journey in the car rather than many journeys or two vehicles and an opportunity for families to participate in something together, compared to spectating other family members as may be the case with other activities. Perhaps other sports are cheaper when it comes to event entry fees but offer less benefit to family life?