just a thought, having done my first duathlon a couple of weeks ago - about half an hour before the race started there was a briefing where someone shouted out the basic rules (no cycling in the changeover area, no sitting in someone else's wind shadow and so on). Most adventure races and fell races have something similar - ok mass start makes it a lot easier but no reason why it couldn't be done for 'normal' O events.
How about having at a colour coded event at 10:30, or 6:30 on a summer evening event or whatever, someone shouting out the basic procedure for the orienteering event (choose correct course, start procedure, punching, importance of reporting to download, etc.) to anyone who wanted to hear. If this was a regular thing and advertised in advance then beginners would know that they'd get some basic help in that kind of thing. ok at many events there might be a handful of takers, if that (all the 'regulars' at the duathlon were doing there own thing and didn't take any notice of the briefing), but if it's a regular thing and there's a set 'script' and always someone ready to do it at that time it would only require a minimal amount of effort for each event.
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Adventure Racer wrote:I can only imagine there is some sort of elitist attitude here
Sadly there is. Which is why some people who are more interested in promoting the sport no longer post here.
Ed wrote:someone shouting out the basic procedure for the orienteering event (choose correct course, start procedure, punching, importance of reporting to download, etc.) to anyone who wanted to hear.
I usually loiter around the registration area and make sure that this is done to newcomers, together with bit of v basic technique training (thumb and turn the map, etc)
Maybe...
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PorkyFatBoy - diehard
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"Why is this more important for adventure racers than those that only orienteer? "
Mark, I didn't mean to imply that this is more important for adventure racers than anyone else.
BTW, my mate Brian has taken up orienteering to get fit and become more attractive to women. Then again I don't see why Orienteering should become a training ground for gigolos.
Mark, I didn't mean to imply that this is more important for adventure racers than anyone else.
BTW, my mate Brian has taken up orienteering to get fit and become more attractive to women. Then again I don't see why Orienteering should become a training ground for gigolos.
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PorkyFatBoy wrote:I usually loiter around the registration area and make sure that this is done to newcomers, together with bit of v basic technique training (thumb and turn the map, etc)
yes, but people may not know in advance that this will be available, and they might feel like a noddy asking for individual help - and of course you could simply miss someone who may benefit. If it's done as a general briefing at a pre-publicised time and place then anyone interested knows when and where, and will probably feel less intimidated about asking for further help in that context.
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Ed - diehard
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Adventure Racer wrote: - I can only imagine there is some sort of elitist attitude here that if you're not a full time orienteer then orienteering doesn't need you, which is kind of strange
ignore gross. he has had treatment for his tourettes syndrome but it is ongoing.
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It seems a little harsh to slag off Adventure Racer because he's not a 'pure' orienteer. I don't see anyone slagging of Bruce Duncan on AR forums because he's not a 'pure' adventure racer.
I don't see the problem with there being an overlap of people who can enjoy both sports and bring skills in to both at the same time.
I use AR as physical fitness for orienteering. Is that so bad? It sure is more fun that going to the gym!
Back to the original topic though... the general age group of adventure racers is exactly the sort of group orienteering is lacking as already discussed ad nauseum. Bringing these 'bright young things' to orienteering would elevate the standing of O, making it more sexy, don't you think? This will then lead to more varied sponsorship of large events, which again will get the sport out there to many more people. No offence meant here, but I'd rather take away North Face gear etc than an Anglo Irish ball point pen in my event goodie bag. (Not that I'm materialistic, much )
Good luck with your stand at the Edinburgh Rat Race Brooner, if we can attract one or two adventure racers to orienteering as a result it will be worth it.
As for advertising AR on nopesport.com etc... I think it's a good idea to get orienteers out in to other sports. On my team's resume for the Bristol Rat Race, I wrote that we were orienteers. Maybe that would have been a better advert if we'd won... but it got the sport a mention on the team posters displayed in the event arena.
I don't see the problem with there being an overlap of people who can enjoy both sports and bring skills in to both at the same time.
I use AR as physical fitness for orienteering. Is that so bad? It sure is more fun that going to the gym!
Back to the original topic though... the general age group of adventure racers is exactly the sort of group orienteering is lacking as already discussed ad nauseum. Bringing these 'bright young things' to orienteering would elevate the standing of O, making it more sexy, don't you think? This will then lead to more varied sponsorship of large events, which again will get the sport out there to many more people. No offence meant here, but I'd rather take away North Face gear etc than an Anglo Irish ball point pen in my event goodie bag. (Not that I'm materialistic, much )
Good luck with your stand at the Edinburgh Rat Race Brooner, if we can attract one or two adventure racers to orienteering as a result it will be worth it.
As for advertising AR on nopesport.com etc... I think it's a good idea to get orienteers out in to other sports. On my team's resume for the Bristol Rat Race, I wrote that we were orienteers. Maybe that would have been a better advert if we'd won... but it got the sport a mention on the team posters displayed in the event arena.
Run rabbit, run
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P2B - orange
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P2B wrote:It seems a little harsh to slag off Adventure Racer because he's not a 'pure' orienteer. I don't see anyone slagging of Bruce Duncan on AR forums because he's not a 'pure' adventure racer.
Now there's an idea - hold on a minute...
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P2B wrote:I use AR as physical fitness for orienteering. Is that so bad? It sure is more fun that going to the gym!
I'm intrigued by that comment. How can AR possibly make good training for anything else when you come back from an event totally stuffed and not wanting to do anything for days afterwards? I've not really done anything since the Rat Race - at least partly as all that tarmac running has made my injuries a lot worse (then again I probably shouldn't have done our club's Park O event last week when I was already suffering a bit with my Achilles, but I enjoy orienteering too much). Seriously, what do you get out of AR training wise that you wouldn't from more normal orienteering training?
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SeanC wrote:"Why is this more important for adventure racers than those that only orienteer? "
Mark, I didn't mean to imply that this is more important for adventure racers than anyone else.
BTW, my mate Brian has taken up orienteering to get fit and become more attractive to women. Then again I don't see why Orienteering should become a training ground for gigolos.
I was probably taking your statement a bit too literally . As well as providing experience, a lot of clubs do put on adult navigation/technique training of course and I'd have thought this would be equally useful to adventure racers as well as orienteers.
BTW(2) How was O advertised to Brian and where? Perhaps we could learn from them- although I'm not sure it'll do what he hopes.
(well it will make him fit ).
Mark
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"BTW(2) How was O advertised to Brian and where? Perhaps we could learn from them- although I'm not sure it'll do what he hopes.
(well it will make him fit ). "
Woops, sorry Mark. I made Brian up to make a (sort of, possibly) humorous response to Gross's comment with the strong language. Sorry that the joke wasn't too obvious.
I raised the original point because a) my club, a well run small club I should say, finds it difficult to do the sort of adult introductory course that you mention, just because we are short of people with the time spare, and b) I am on a major work avoidance exercise.
(well it will make him fit ). "
Woops, sorry Mark. I made Brian up to make a (sort of, possibly) humorous response to Gross's comment with the strong language. Sorry that the joke wasn't too obvious.
I raised the original point because a) my club, a well run small club I should say, finds it difficult to do the sort of adult introductory course that you mention, just because we are short of people with the time spare, and b) I am on a major work avoidance exercise.
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Adventure Racer wrote:How can AR possibly make good training for anything else when you come back from an event totally stuffed and not wanting to do anything for days afterwards?
Can't really comment on this given I've not done one but I can see where you're coming from. It wasn't long ago that I'd let my fitness drop to a level where an M21L did this to me and I generally went weekend to weekend destroying myself and then recovering all week. However somehow through doing this I did raise myself up to be fit enough to do it and to cope, and then to go on and be able to train mid-week. So perhaps doing this sort of long training is good for you every so often?
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Looking at the top 3 teams at this weekend’s race, 2 had ex GB squad orienteers in them and one had an adventure racer who has come into the sport of orienteering initially to improve his navigation, but who now orienteers regularly because he enjoys orienteering in its own right. Orienteers (that includes all 3 of the above by the way!) doing well at such events is hardly a new phenomenon (e.g. Dave, Jenny, Killian, Steve B, Bruce, John Emberton, Janine, the list goes on) and most of these continue to orienteer whilst doing these other sports as well.
Whilst people who are originally from an orienteering background who do well at other navigation races (i.e. adventure races, mms, trailquests, MTBO) can be used to increase the profile of orienteering, it is the success stories for orienteering such as Chris (aka Adventure Racer) and others such as John Houlihan, who could be really powerful examples to use in advertising orienteering (with their consent of course!). Both are very successful in non-orienteering navigation sports, but have tried orienteering initially to improve their navigation but now regularly participate in orienteering as a sport in its own right.
People doing adventure races are obviously keen to try new things, they are typically in the ‘target age group’ and most are competitive sorts who want to improve their weaker areas. For many this may be navigation and so orienteering needs to be cashing in on this. Only this weekend, one of my team mates asked how she could improve her own navigation skills to which there was only one answer – get along to a local orienteering event.
That leads me on to the opportunity that IMO is currently being missed. Prior to the Rat Race, I was glad to hear that there would be an orienteering stand at the event. When I found the stand, my feelings of disappointment mirrored those articulated by P2B i.e. “it lacked a certain amount of perzaz” and “when you compared the stand to the other stalls around, it was just some examples of maps and a bored looking (sorry) lady in green o-bums.”. It was great that someone was making the effort but for me it just didn’t hit the mark on any of the following:
- Showing the younger face of orienteering;
- Selling the potential benefits to the target audience – see above;
- Portraying orienteering as the challenging/exciting sport that it is (e.g. a video showing major events such as the world champs or major relays would do this);
- Something to take away that has the BOF website link on it so people can find out about events in their local area; and
- A chance to try a mini event there and then – not always possible I know but there will be hundreds of people at the Ed race with time to kill between registration and the race start.
The energy and passion for orienteering demonstrated on this forum is incredible. The challenge is now to divert some of that energy into organising a truly compelling stand at the Ed Rat Race (and at other suitable races thereafter). I’ll be at the race and am happy to help out for a while but I can’t do more than that as my priority will the race itself.
Andy
Whilst people who are originally from an orienteering background who do well at other navigation races (i.e. adventure races, mms, trailquests, MTBO) can be used to increase the profile of orienteering, it is the success stories for orienteering such as Chris (aka Adventure Racer) and others such as John Houlihan, who could be really powerful examples to use in advertising orienteering (with their consent of course!). Both are very successful in non-orienteering navigation sports, but have tried orienteering initially to improve their navigation but now regularly participate in orienteering as a sport in its own right.
People doing adventure races are obviously keen to try new things, they are typically in the ‘target age group’ and most are competitive sorts who want to improve their weaker areas. For many this may be navigation and so orienteering needs to be cashing in on this. Only this weekend, one of my team mates asked how she could improve her own navigation skills to which there was only one answer – get along to a local orienteering event.
That leads me on to the opportunity that IMO is currently being missed. Prior to the Rat Race, I was glad to hear that there would be an orienteering stand at the event. When I found the stand, my feelings of disappointment mirrored those articulated by P2B i.e. “it lacked a certain amount of perzaz” and “when you compared the stand to the other stalls around, it was just some examples of maps and a bored looking (sorry) lady in green o-bums.”. It was great that someone was making the effort but for me it just didn’t hit the mark on any of the following:
- Showing the younger face of orienteering;
- Selling the potential benefits to the target audience – see above;
- Portraying orienteering as the challenging/exciting sport that it is (e.g. a video showing major events such as the world champs or major relays would do this);
- Something to take away that has the BOF website link on it so people can find out about events in their local area; and
- A chance to try a mini event there and then – not always possible I know but there will be hundreds of people at the Ed race with time to kill between registration and the race start.
The energy and passion for orienteering demonstrated on this forum is incredible. The challenge is now to divert some of that energy into organising a truly compelling stand at the Ed Rat Race (and at other suitable races thereafter). I’ll be at the race and am happy to help out for a while but I can’t do more than that as my priority will the race itself.
Andy
Last edited by AndyS on Fri Jun 17, 2005 8:36 am, edited 1 time in total.
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