Junior Badge Scheme
Moderators: [nope] cartel, team nopesport
yeah good luck to seds. i have just started the Dorset Elite Athletes Development Squad (DEADS), there's currently one member (me) but new members are welcome. unfortunately the male quota has been taken up for this years new intake but there are currently 5 female spots available. No orienteering experience is necessary but please supply a photo.
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bendover - addict
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Back to Becks point . Wouldn't it be possible to spread to more mixed ability if more coaches/helpers involved? More coaches might be keen to go if this was model for the tour. Some may prefer coaching to bring people through to higher level, before backing out. Certainly happens in athletics. START squad and others could use same exercises but different days, plus differing sessions for specific needs. Taking more shouldn't detract from what Start members are there to achieve, but giving others experience in Scandinavia might help keep gap close enough to jump.
- ifititches
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I'd just like to point out that yes B tours did used to exist but there was just an A tour and a B tour for each 2 year age band.
Now there is one A tour for each single year age group so the total number of people going on tour now is the same as it was then.
I personally think the old system was better because you got to mix with older and younger people each year which I think pushes you more than training with the same few each year, on tour.
Elite sport is tough, you have to work hard to make it and take set backs. Maybe it is just as important to learn this from a young age as it is to learn the navigation and teach your body to train hard and run strongly. Of course sport is also fun, i think tours used to be more about fun (which was good and we still trained hard) but now the money is there to develop future elite athletes not just to keep people in the sport.
Carol McNeil weekends. Happy days.
Now there is one A tour for each single year age group so the total number of people going on tour now is the same as it was then.
I personally think the old system was better because you got to mix with older and younger people each year which I think pushes you more than training with the same few each year, on tour.
Elite sport is tough, you have to work hard to make it and take set backs. Maybe it is just as important to learn this from a young age as it is to learn the navigation and teach your body to train hard and run strongly. Of course sport is also fun, i think tours used to be more about fun (which was good and we still trained hard) but now the money is there to develop future elite athletes not just to keep people in the sport.
Carol McNeil weekends. Happy days.
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Anonymous wrote:I'd just like to point out that yes B tours did used to exist but there was just an A tour and a B tour for each 2 year age band.
Now there is one A tour for each single year age group so the total number of people going on tour now is the same as it was then.
Except of course now it is almost the same group of people going each time instead of two seperate groups.
This is all very interesting and I personally think the fact that we are talking about B tours should not be buried in some soppy soft-speak. I don't think anyone here want to erode the status of the start squad or the achievements of those who gain selection for it ( no matter what rude guest thinks) the message seems clear that most people think a b tour was beneficial to the sport in general - and as I said before Medals are the icing on the cake - not the cake itself - we won't have a cake if we don't keep kids of all ages interested and motivated - parents pay the full whack for their kids to go on all sort of sporting tours ( world schools cost a whacking £500 ) why not the b tour? I do hope people in power are taking note of this debate.
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Mrs H. - nope godmother
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Except of course now it is almost the same group of people going each time instead of two seperate groups.
Not really. It was about the top 16 boys and top 16 girls in M/W15/16. It just meant that the really good people got 2 weeks in Scandinavia twice and the quite good people went to Scotland and then Scandinavia and the people still improving and coming through went to Scotland once or Scandi once. Generally it was the same people, as it is now. They introduced a rule later that meant you couldn't go to the Scotland tour twice because it meant you weren't improving. It was the same people getting picked for a tour, just different mixes on each. Even back then people who didn't go to Lagganlia felt out of the loop and that they couldn't bridge the gap and get back in. It doesn't matter that it has a name now "start squad" it's basically the same deal but the funding situation is better now.
If there is the demand, commercial training tours in the UK are a great idea. In fact elsewhere they already exist, Oringen Clinics, WWOP etc The problem would be manpower. "The powers that be" can only do so much. If someone else wants to set something up without funding that people would pay for themselves then that's great. My guess is they would have trouble getting the coaches etc, they don't even have enough willing coaches for the BOF tours at the moment.
One route that could be utilised however is to link up with a Scandinavian club. Most clubs have a wealth of experienced english speaking coaches, good maps, a club hut for people to stay in and people to control hang. Perhaps they would welcome a link because it could bring in some money plus could even eventually bring in new promising relay team members. All it would take would be a plan and an email to some of the clubs to see if they are interested. Clubs clustered around the ryanair airfields would probably be best. It would also need a driving force behind the idea (Mrs H? or?) and a number of keen juniors, willing to pay (not a huge amount tho).
On a smaller scale juniors wanting to come out here and train for short periods or even whole summers, the opportunities are here. You will find in orienteering there are huge numbers of fantastic people willing to help you and make time for you if you want to improve. You just have to ask.
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harry - addict
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Even back then people who didn't go to Lagganlia felt out of the loop and that they couldn't bridge the gap and get back in. It doesn't matter that it has a name now "start squad" it's basically the same deal but the funding situation is better now.
I think I disagree. At least tours then felt like a level playing field, so regardless of who had gone before everyone in theory had an equal chance of going the next and would go to all the selection races on the off chance. Mentally to a junior this makes a huge difference. As Jene says, she didn't even make the effort to go to most of the races because they knew the start squadders by the age of 16 were far ahead of them. Maybe if they'd have had a B Tour the year before some of them would have bridged the gap as Lily did, which I'm sure took a lot of hard work.
Tours are fantastic and there's no denying that the Start squad one to Halden did a huge amount for everyone involved (coaches included!). But I am very worried that there are only 5 girls in that age group progressing up to greater things - it strikes of putting all your eggs in one basket, and where are the coaches/planners of the future going to come from?
I've said it once and if I sound like a broken record then I apologise. If we'd put the kids in the start squad that were the stars on our Lagganlia you'd have me left coaching by now, El and I struggling along the bottom of the elite ranks, and Laura Daniel competing, along with Mr Furness and Dave Sprot turning up to some events. Names such as Matthew Speake (Who wasn't even good enough out of the Yorkshire lot to go to Lagganlia then!) and Neil Northrop could well have dropped off the radar and decided their talents were appreciated in cross country/adventure racing instead. They may have perservered, but who know how many potential stars have been put off by not getting in the start squad?
I would be up for coaching on a B tour, though I do have responsibilities to Juniors in Start so that would only be if they didn't clash (ah the joys of a student summer!). If tours were a week long, I think we would find more people willing to help, rather than the two week beasts such as Halden and Uppsala.
The coaches are coming through, mainly inspired through this place. If we want to make this happen and there is the demand, I think we can.
Will? We've got proper fire now!
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Becks - god
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I absolutely agree with Becks - it's an investment in the future of the sport not just winning medals.
Incidentally the WM set up a link with a Swedish club a few years back and have had two non-selective tours to Sweden paid for by parents - so we're obviously way ahead of the game there - it's brilliant and i highly recommend it to all regions - but it don't think anyone would think it had the same edge to it as a selected tour - either A or B.
Incidentally the WM set up a link with a Swedish club a few years back and have had two non-selective tours to Sweden paid for by parents - so we're obviously way ahead of the game there - it's brilliant and i highly recommend it to all regions - but it don't think anyone would think it had the same edge to it as a selected tour - either A or B.
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Mrs H. - nope godmother
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maybe they should start low-key first, set up a tour or 2 in britain then progress to scandi? surely if we could get an independant tour up and running here it would be easier to forge links across with the scandi clubs cos they'll see that the tours mean business and are commited. Just a thought...
oh and i think i may have not read the rude post, i can't be bothered going to find it either, and i don't think i'd want to by the sounds of it.
warning to jene to; rhys FR was quite annoyed bout the whole "Wales are crap" campaign... ur not that bad can i just say! be more optimistic!
oh and i think i may have not read the rude post, i can't be bothered going to find it either, and i don't think i'd want to by the sounds of it.
warning to jene to; rhys FR was quite annoyed bout the whole "Wales are crap" campaign... ur not that bad can i just say! be more optimistic!
"Being defeated is only a temporary condition; giving up is what makes it permanent."
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What would you wear when zombies attack??
The amazing NWJS boys and their human pyramid act, touring near you soon...
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Lizi Beee - brown
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Wales are not crap. They were never crap and they will never be crap. We just have a smaller pool of runners which only goes to underline our strength. Quality rather than quantity. Look at the JHI results. Impressive. Look at the last 2 SHI relays. Jene, I have already been chatting to Cerys about how we can revive the Welsh Squad's banterous all ages training weekends we used to have. I know the juniors have lots of training weekends already but when i was a junior it was great to train with Alice and Liz every now and then. Will work on this when I get back to the UK. I guess the problem is we already have a packed squad program to work around, but surely we can fit one weekend in this winter, maybe some time in Jan or Feb and go from there. John Mayock is in charge of development of O within the Sports Council for Wales now. Not too sure what this job involves but I asked Phil jenkins a while back what John could do to help but maybe will go to the man himself next. We also would like to get some new welsh kit. Maybe this should have been a PM to Jene sorry everyone.
PS there wasn't a rude post, maybe just one that contradicted Mrs H. they often get branded as rude. someone is oversensitive. go on, confound my suspicions. go on, go on, go on.
sorry again, i'm over exuberant from 2 days perfect training. in perfect weather. in perfect terrain. with perhaps a little too much nopesport between sessions!!
PS there wasn't a rude post, maybe just one that contradicted Mrs H. they often get branded as rude. someone is oversensitive. go on, confound my suspicions. go on, go on, go on.
sorry again, i'm over exuberant from 2 days perfect training. in perfect weather. in perfect terrain. with perhaps a little too much nopesport between sessions!!
Last edited by harry on Sun Sep 12, 2004 9:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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harry - addict
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Melons wrote:Wales are not crap. .
No they're not crap, far from. However, if this was the banter section....
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rob f - yellow
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Melons wrote: confound my suspicions.
Well i'd hate to disappoint you - BTW did you mean "confirm". It's true they weren't rude itn the way the posts you made which were moderated were rude but they seemed very disrespectful to a lot of people who thought that B tours were a good idea. Carol and Becks also thought they were rude - are you going to have a go at them - or is it just an excuse to have a go at me? It really isn't too hard to work out where this is coming from - let me know when you have an original thought!
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Mrs H. - nope godmother
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geez. i'll PM you about this. but no, i was asking you to prove me wrong, not right. but you didn't.
here we go with the stuff about my mother again. no, i'm in sweden. i ring her once a week and we don't talk about nope. i have lots of original thoughts, i usually keep them to myself tho.
here we go with the stuff about my mother again. no, i'm in sweden. i ring her once a week and we don't talk about nope. i have lots of original thoughts, i usually keep them to myself tho.
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harry - addict
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