I am writing this the day after 140,000 people have gathered at Silverstone racecourse. Tens of thousands of people have been joining audiences at football events for weeks. During the current public health emergency these and other gatherings have been justified as "infection control experiments" . I know of no such experiment involving orienteering. How could it be done ?
Most of us think that due to the dispersed nature of the game the infection risk of orienteering is extremely small, but how small ? How would we work that out ?
Using GPS trackers is quite common in Orienteering. A lot of us are familiar with Routegadget. If we don't have a Garmen-esque device most of us have a smart phone which could load a GPX tracker app Some chat after an O meet at the weekend brought back memories of a televised infection control experiment in 2018. The BBC 4 programme was called "Contagion" and was presented by that Hannah Fry; they used mobile phones to track public contacts (see https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p05x9b6n ).
It should be possible to organise an experimental O event of maybe 500+ participants where a condition of entry is that everybody agrees to produce a GPX track of their day from arrival in the carpark to departure after the last control is in and then email it to a researcher to run through mapping software, in the style of the BBC programme. Then BOF would have some hard evidence on which to base their arguments, for now and the future.
Any thoughts ? Anybody got a tame Phd student ?
Orienteering and infection
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Re: Orienteering and infection
The risk while we are out on the courses is trivial. The possibility of infection at O events will be where gatherings occur - mainly at assembly areas, start and download. Which is why the control measure put in place during lockdown focussed on removing these with competitors advised to turn up - run - download - and go straight home.
Even though we don't have legal restrictions any more, we still need to think about things such as club tents at big events, results displays, ventilation and crowds where registration and download are indoors. This is likely to be more of a problem in the autumn and winter when events are run on cold wet days and we are seeking shelter from the elements.
Even though we don't have legal restrictions any more, we still need to think about things such as club tents at big events, results displays, ventilation and crowds where registration and download are indoors. This is likely to be more of a problem in the autumn and winter when events are run on cold wet days and we are seeking shelter from the elements.
- pete.owens
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Re: Orienteering and infection
pete.owens wrote:Even though we don't have legal restrictions any more, we still need to think about things such as club tents at big events, results displays, ventilation and crowds where registration and download are indoors.
That is your view and your entitled to it. An alternative view is that we should get back to focusing on making orienteering as attractive as possible, particularly for young people and the not so young who value the social side. Registration on the day, results displays, club tents, busy arenas, shops, catering, social activities etc.
We are obliged to follow government and landowner guidelines and individuals can certainly take their own precautions if they feel vulnerable to infection, but if orienteering doesn't bounce back with an attractive proposition then it will become another victim of the pandemic.
To oblivion and beyond....
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buzz - addict
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Re: Orienteering and infection
pete.owens wrote:The risk while we are out on the courses is trivial....
This misses the point. I'm sure you're right about the risk being greater in other parts of an event, but...
Davy's post is about how we collect evidence on the risk of our events. I agree with him that it'd be helpful to have something you could share with a landowner or local authority or whatever. It sounds to me like a great idea, and exactly the kind of thing BOF could/should sponsor.
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Crex - white
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Re: Orienteering and infection
pete.owens wrote:Even though we don't have legal restrictions any more, we still need to think about ...
per my last post, I think you went off-topic here. But, for the record, I tend to agree with Buzz on this point.
Imho we must make the unavoidable bits of an O event as safe a possible (i.e. start procedure, start boxes, download). Pretty much everything else is, in fact, optional (club tents, registration (online could be made available for each event), viewing results, chatting with friends, etc etc etc.). If we let people opt in/opt out of those more social activities, it can be safe for those who need it and fun for those who want fun.
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Crex - white
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Re: Orienteering and infection
Sorry, but want are you trying to record exactly - surely not to track the infection - as there is no way to tell who catches it from who and where and when!?
Anyone know to be infected shouldnt even be there, and would be some time later that it 'might' be known for them to become infected, and even then, from any source.
Anyone know to be infected shouldnt even be there, and would be some time later that it 'might' be known for them to become infected, and even then, from any source.
- nooomember
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Re: Orienteering and infection
Worth a read...
https://orienteering.sport/a-wake-up-call-from-covid-19/
https://orienteering.sport/a-wake-up-call-from-covid-19/
- Patrick
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Re: Orienteering and infection
Interesting report Patrick, yet so little analysis available to a reader, such as whether these individuals were in close contact with each other. Also, all but two had positive tests afterwards, leaving the possibility they might have been infected in enclosed spaces when travelling home.
Does anyone know whether pro cycling teams require their riders to be fully vaccinated, as the infections at the Grand Tours have been quite low this year?
Does anyone know whether pro cycling teams require their riders to be fully vaccinated, as the infections at the Grand Tours have been quite low this year?
- maprun
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Re: Orienteering and infection
by nooomember » Thu Jul 22, 2021 4:03 pm
Sorry, but want are you trying to record exactly - surely not to track the infection
Covid will pass, hopefully soon. It may drag on for years, gradually fading. Other epidemics will follow, population growth and climate change will drive that. As a sport we seem to have a problem explaining our risks to local authorities and land owners who know nothing of our doings.
The risk from a disease derives from it's infectivity and the proximity of possible victims, hence the WHO Covid risk assessment that being closer than 2 meters for longer than 15 minutes increases risk. The 2018 experiment measured the proximity factor. You can read more about the experiment on;
https://www.lshtm.ac.uk/newsevents/news ... esearchers
https://researchonline.lshtm.ac.uk/id/e ... ndemic.pdf
This is a mapping exercise, something that orienteers should be good at. As has been pointed out parts of our operation (club tents, catering, results boards etc) encourage proximity and have a higher risk. What are the numbers, how proximate are we, what are the risks ? How can we demonstrate our (probably low) risk to Authority ?
My derivative proposal is that BOF organise an experiment where we run a biggish O event under as near to normal conditions as we can manage. Everybody who attends the event, whether running or not, carries a GPS tracker (probably the phone with a GPS tracker app) for the whole day. The tracks would be mapped over the map of the whole site. The result would be a wodge of real world data.
Anybody know whether any foreign orienteering organisations have published any hard data ? Scandinavia or eastern Europe maybe ?
- Davy
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Re: Orienteering and infection
buzz wrote:That is your view and your entitled to it. An alternative view.....
None of what you say precludes the fact that we should be thinking about how the various things pete.owens lists are addressed - how can these things be done in as safe a possible way. Pete says we should be thinking about them, not that we should be excluding them or ignoring the issues. It's not just the gung-ho who we need to attract either for the first time of back to the sport.
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awk - god
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Re: Orienteering and infection
Well, I'm still trying to fully understand all the implications of the requirements outlined in the mitigation measures for the World Cup races in Sweden next week. Some of it is relatively clear but other parts not quite so clear. https://eventor.orienteering.org/Documents/Event/4443/1/World-Cup-2021-Round-2---COVID-19-Event-Bulletin
- Domhnull Mor
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Re: Orienteering and infection
Looks pretty onerous... Hope all goes well.
- Big Jon
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Re: Orienteering and infection
Has anyone heard of any Covid infection arising from this years 6 Days ?
- Davy
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Re: Orienteering and infection
Davy wrote:Has anyone heard of any Covid infection arising from this years 6 Days ?
I got Covid whilst at the 6 Days.
I'm pretty sure it was not whilst at one of the (three) events though...
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Homer - diehard
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