I do admit to being a keen golfer (handicap 11 or exact handicap 10.6) and find the system very fair. This year I have won a number of competitions when I have played well (at or better than my handicap) and wondered if it was realistic/possible to derive an orienteering handicapping system that allowed runners to compete on a more equal footing?
For those who do not understand golf and the handicap system it is essentially simple, but covered under what is called CONGU. Each course has a par, that is the number of strokes expected to play a round (pars for individual holes are 3,4 or 5). If the course par is 72 and I go round in 90 my nett score would be 79 (7 over par). After this game my handicap would be adjusted slightly and go up to 10.7. If I do better my handicap could be cut and for most golfers it is aspirational to get lower handicaps. Typically in any club competition there is what is called a Scratch section (no handicaps to count) plus a couple of divisions of low and high handicaps (usually 12 or over).
I carried out an analysis of runs over the weekend plus a few equivalent events (Schiehallion weekend, SOLs) but excluded local events, sprints etc. I used my time from the Scottish Spring Bonskeid race (a good race, not exceptional or bad) and applied a race handicap of 4 min 00 secs per kilometre (distance plus height climb). On this basis I was close to but did not better the winning time. I used the same handicap for other races, and my adjusted (nett) time now gives me a very good comparison against the winning time. At the SOL in Affric I wrote down 7 mins mistakes on my post-race analysis, and indeed under the handicap system I was about 9 minutes adrift of the winner. I probably only lost 2 minutes of navigational time at Glen Gynack, and indeed was 2 minutes off the winning time. The handicap is probably a bit generous, maybe 3min 30 sec would be fairer to give the winners a clear lead.
I am sure many clubs have run informal handicapping systems before , but could there be an "official" handicap system to make races more competitive (but still a "scratch" winner as well as handicap winners)? At the Moravian club championships Eddie derived an individual course for each runner - essentially a handicap system. I ran well and came third, and the two who beat me also had good races.
I am going to keep my own handicap system going, and to ensure fairness will raise or lower the handicap after each round (of the forest). Thoughts?
Orienteering handicap system
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Orienteering handicap system
Fac et Spera. Views expressed are not necessarily those of the Scottish 6 Days Assistant Coordinator
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Freefall - addict
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Re: Orienteering handicap system
1. You have too much time on your hands!!
2. Its a nice idea but probably only attractive to old duffers like us.
3. Great - it means for the next SOL you only need to plan one black course...
2. Its a nice idea but probably only attractive to old duffers like us.
3. Great - it means for the next SOL you only need to plan one black course...
Orienteering - its no walk in the park
- andypat
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Re: Orienteering handicap system
How to compete on a more equal footing? Do some training. I thought the idea in competitive sport was that the best athlete won.
I'm all for fun handicaps now and again though. think Eddie used the BOF rankings list as much as poss to derive handicaps.
I'm all for fun handicaps now and again though. think Eddie used the BOF rankings list as much as poss to derive handicaps.
- Sunlit Forres
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Re: Orienteering handicap system
Golf is perhaps simpler in the number of parameters. At our local Parkrun I outrun some people downhill who then overtake me uphill (it is a lumpy course). At the recent Purple Thistle I was faster than a couple of people that are usually faster than me because they have shorter legs than me and the tussocks were high (deep?). Different types of terrain take different navigational skills. Etcetera.
But then I know nothing about golf
But then I know nothing about golf
- Rosine
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Re: Orienteering handicap system
As it is lunchtime Andy I will respond to various points (that's point 1)
Point 2 - yes, probably
Point 3 - Handicap relates to normal course run (in my case Blue) - handicap would be adjusted if just against own age group as the Blue winners are now typically M16s or M55s
Sunlitforres - even with handicaps sport is still very competitive, and as I said their is still the scratch category to compete for (no handicap). I do more training in my other sport (physical and mental as well as skills based) and it does work and makes me more competitive, hence lowering handicap. However no matter how much training I do I cannot hope to compete at the top level (physical and injury barriers come into play). Hence system is fair.
Rosine - golf is probably as complex or more so in terms of parameters. Different courses, different weather, different conditions on the course e.g. speed of greens and the fact that you have a multitude of different lengths of shot to consider. The attraction of golf is that it is very similar to orienteering.
I would agree that there probably needs to be an adjustment for different types of terrain, but the results I calculated (for "proper" Scottish orienteering) proved remarkably consistent.
Point 2 - yes, probably
Point 3 - Handicap relates to normal course run (in my case Blue) - handicap would be adjusted if just against own age group as the Blue winners are now typically M16s or M55s
Sunlitforres - even with handicaps sport is still very competitive, and as I said their is still the scratch category to compete for (no handicap). I do more training in my other sport (physical and mental as well as skills based) and it does work and makes me more competitive, hence lowering handicap. However no matter how much training I do I cannot hope to compete at the top level (physical and injury barriers come into play). Hence system is fair.
Rosine - golf is probably as complex or more so in terms of parameters. Different courses, different weather, different conditions on the course e.g. speed of greens and the fact that you have a multitude of different lengths of shot to consider. The attraction of golf is that it is very similar to orienteering.
I would agree that there probably needs to be an adjustment for different types of terrain, but the results I calculated (for "proper" Scottish orienteering) proved remarkably consistent.
Fac et Spera. Views expressed are not necessarily those of the Scottish 6 Days Assistant Coordinator
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Freefall - addict
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Re: Orienteering handicap system
Freefall - you are right on the parameter piece with golf. For 2 years my handicap was based on the High Course at Moor Park, which meant I was a bandit on most other courses in the UK. Now in playing in parkland Cambs means I can't play any difficult courses anywhere near to handicap.
Back to orienteering Handicaps - RAFO once tried (it was Little Geoff's idea) a chasing start handicap at the sprint race before the Harvester - handicaps were allocated according to BMI, which meant (he didn't realize when developing the handicap formula that I was 40 Kg heavier than him) that I was 100m from the finish when he started his 3.2Km run.....
I vote we go with BMI as the basis for orienteering handicaping..... But as a short fat bloke I would say that
Back to orienteering Handicaps - RAFO once tried (it was Little Geoff's idea) a chasing start handicap at the sprint race before the Harvester - handicaps were allocated according to BMI, which meant (he didn't realize when developing the handicap formula that I was 40 Kg heavier than him) that I was 100m from the finish when he started his 3.2Km run.....
I vote we go with BMI as the basis for orienteering handicaping..... But as a short fat bloke I would say that
hop fat boy, hop!
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madmike - guru
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Re: Orienteering handicap system
You can't just use BMI, you need to have miles of training per week, and controls found in the previous year as well...
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mharky - team nopesport
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Re: Orienteering handicap system
I did have a formula for just distance runner, which was miles per week and BMI, and it worked quite well
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mharky - team nopesport
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Re: Orienteering handicap system
For many years LOK have coordinated a series of summer events based on everyone running the same course c 4km in parkland. Originally the handicapping was based on a certain number of minutes for each of age, sex and badge standard. Lately it's more golf-like:
http://londonorienteering.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2016/06/GLOSS-ranking-data-handicap-times-June-2016.pdf
http://londonorienteering.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2016/06/GLOSS-ranking-data-handicap-times-June-2016.pdf
- afterthought
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