emit touch free
Moderators: [nope] cartel, team nopesport
51 posts
• Page 1 of 4 • 1, 2, 3, 4
emit touch free
As used at Sprints and Middles ... so what did we all think?
- iainwp
- orange
- Posts: 100
- Joined: Tue Dec 24, 2013 8:55 pm
- Location: loughborough
Re: emit touch free
Positives - Neat compact technology. Allowed much quicker flow through controls as didn't need to accurate match up SI or EMIT cards as per old tech. Visual confirmation of punch was useful.
Negatives - flashes for 10 seconds and anecdotally heard that that caused problems as you could still be flashing from being close to another control (and inadvertantly punch it), and hence not punch yours with the 10 second period. Also lots of batteries which means more equipment to replace more often.
Negatives - flashes for 10 seconds and anecdotally heard that that caused problems as you could still be flashing from being close to another control (and inadvertantly punch it), and hence not punch yours with the 10 second period. Also lots of batteries which means more equipment to replace more often.
- paul
- yellow
- Posts: 88
- Joined: Sun Nov 11, 2007 10:57 am
Re: emit touch free
Worked well for me. Agree control flow easier. And Finish good, particularly if in a bunch.
Not so sure about Starts - it worked with a timed start, but I am less clear about how it would work with a punching start? Is there a danger that the organisational set-up will trigger it to start "early"? And in the Sprint Heats I think there were one or two people who somehow managed to get too close to the Start set-up between Finish and Download, and so cleared their tag.
Main concern for me was the number of controls on Saturday that could be successfully "punched" from the wrong side of a "not to be crossed" boundary - but that was more of a planning / controlling and "terrain suitability" issue - I thought the Heats area, with lots of uncrossable hedges, was better suited for a contact rather than contactless technology.
Not so sure about Starts - it worked with a timed start, but I am less clear about how it would work with a punching start? Is there a danger that the organisational set-up will trigger it to start "early"? And in the Sprint Heats I think there were one or two people who somehow managed to get too close to the Start set-up between Finish and Download, and so cleared their tag.
Main concern for me was the number of controls on Saturday that could be successfully "punched" from the wrong side of a "not to be crossed" boundary - but that was more of a planning / controlling and "terrain suitability" issue - I thought the Heats area, with lots of uncrossable hedges, was better suited for a contact rather than contactless technology.
- Snail
- diehard
- Posts: 709
- Joined: Wed Nov 30, 2005 8:37 pm
Re: emit touch free
paul wrote:Positives - Neat compact technology. Allowed much quicker flow through controls as didn't need to accurate match up SI or EMIT cards as per old tech. Visual confirmation of punch was useful.
Visual confirmation away from the control especially.
paul wrote:Negatives - flashes for 10 seconds and anecdotally heard that that caused problems as you could still be flashing from being close to another control (and inadvertantly punch it), and hence not punch yours with the 10 second period. Also lots of batteries which means more equipment to replace more often.
which leads to the question: Can you record another punch while the tag is still flashing from the previous one? Heard both answers over the weekend. Does anyone have a definitive answer (and reference?)
Iain
- iainwp
- orange
- Posts: 100
- Joined: Tue Dec 24, 2013 8:55 pm
- Location: loughborough
Re: emit touch free
For me it is too unfair as some tags work from quite along way away picking up controls about 2metres away whereas others have to actually touch the controls. The tags need to be consistent. I also don't like having to look for a flashing light after punching as you want to be reading the map then not worrying about whether it has punched.
- batty
- off string
- Posts: 49
- Joined: Fri Oct 12, 2007 1:52 pm
Re: emit touch free
Can you record another punch while the tag is still flashing from the previous one?
http://orienteering.org/user-instructions-for-emit-touch-free-system-available/
Emit Touch-Free Pro (TFP) control units and emiTag control cards are both
battery powered. The TFP control unit creates a field which extends to
approximately 80 cm from the unit. The emiTag must be within the field of the
TFP control unit for at least 0.07 seconds in order to record a “punch”. When a
competitor is moving at high speed, the emiTag needs to be considerably closer
than 80 cm in order to record a punch. The TFP unit transmits its code to the
emiTag and it is stored in the internal memory along with the time of the punch.
- drobin
- light green
- Posts: 224
- Joined: Thu Dec 07, 2006 12:49 pm
- Location: Boringstoke
Re: emit touch free
Am I missing something in the various 'official' documents? I don't think there is an answer to Iain's query about whether you can register at a control if the tag is still flashing from a previous control or a control that you happen to have passed en route to your control.
- Nottinghamshire outlaw
- red
- Posts: 177
- Joined: Mon Feb 27, 2006 7:24 pm
Re: emit touch free
I gather that some tests were done on Saturday once this concern had been raised and it was confirmed that the tags did register a new punch even while still flashing from the previous punch.
Although I've had no problems in the four events that I've run using this system, I heard too many accounts of not-easily explained problems over the weekend to have confidence in the system. It was also unfortunate that on Saturday in particular commentary were frequently not getting feedback from the finish control/arch/wire. Potential but not there yet.
Although I've had no problems in the four events that I've run using this system, I heard too many accounts of not-easily explained problems over the weekend to have confidence in the system. It was also unfortunate that on Saturday in particular commentary were frequently not getting feedback from the finish control/arch/wire. Potential but not there yet.
Last edited by NeilC on Mon May 11, 2015 9:52 am, edited 1 time in total.
- NeilC
- addict
- Posts: 1332
- Joined: Fri Dec 17, 2004 9:03 am
- Location: SE
Re: emit touch free
Nottinghamshire outlaw wrote:Am I missing something in the various 'official' documents? I don't think there is an answer to Iain's query about whether you can register at a control if the tag is still flashing from a previous control or a control that you happen to have passed en route to your control.
Many took less than 10s from the last control to the finish in the heats, so the answer must surely be yes.
- roadrunner
- addict
- Posts: 1059
- Joined: Fri Sep 02, 2005 8:30 pm
Re: emit touch free
I think you must be able to successfully register - as there are a number of people with splits of less than 10 seconds. Arguably it slightly penalises the better orienteers, as on a very short leg the faster you are the more likely your tag is still flashing from the previous control, so you may fail to register without realising. But with greater usage we would probably all learn to punch "slower" on a very short leg.
- Snail
- diehard
- Posts: 709
- Joined: Wed Nov 30, 2005 8:37 pm
Re: emit touch free
roadrunner wrote:Nottinghamshire outlaw wrote:Am I missing something in the various 'official' documents? I don't think there is an answer to Iain's query about whether you can register at a control if the tag is still flashing from a previous control or a control that you happen to have passed en route to your control.
Many took less than 10s from the last control to the finish in the heats, so the answer must surely be yes.
Some 12 months ago (or thereabouts) I did an unofficial test with about ten units
some 3 metres apart and walking from the first to the last gave me 10 correct records/punches and the ETag was flashing all the time until 10 seconds after the last punch.
So FWIW I think that you can successfully register a punch whilst the ETag is still
flashing,but unless you know you are close enough and/or slow enough you cannot tell
if the ETag in flashing from punch "n" or punch "n-1".
My current technique to ensure a recorded punch is to make hand contact with the
Touch-Free unit, then the speed of passing the Touch-Free unit is not an issue.
(I know -- this means that the Touch-Free unit is no longer Touch-Free.)
- MIE
- green
- Posts: 370
- Joined: Fri Jan 11, 2008 10:05 pm
Re: emit touch free
I am reliably informed that you can't register the same control punch within 10s but you can register a different control punch after 1.2s has elapsed.
So it seems that the car park myth that punching a second control would not be registered if this happened within 10s of getting a punch from another control is incorrect.
This is confirmed by MIE's experiment.
So it seems that the car park myth that punching a second control would not be registered if this happened within 10s of getting a punch from another control is incorrect.
This is confirmed by MIE's experiment.
- DJM
- diehard
- Posts: 979
- Joined: Sun Sep 30, 2007 8:19 pm
- Location: Wye Valley
Re: emit touch free
we would probably all learn to punch "slower" on a very short leg
On reflection, this is insufficient, as for any leg you may have passed a control on another course within 10 seconds of arriving at your control (and possibly without even seeing it)
- Snail
- diehard
- Posts: 709
- Joined: Wed Nov 30, 2005 8:37 pm
Re: emit touch free
Does anyone know what happened at 195 (9 on F1A) ? Splits suggest 7 of the 18 on Men's Open mispunched but have been reinstated - was the control unit faulty?
- Snail
- diehard
- Posts: 709
- Joined: Wed Nov 30, 2005 8:37 pm
Re: emit touch free
The other determining characteristic is that the flash is rapid for the first 2-3 seconds, then reducing to a flash every second (or thereabouts). During development a balance must have been struck between providing a long enough opportunity to check that the unit had registered and not too long to confuse separate controls. With experience, and better explanation, it is perfectly possible to identify if the flashing is from the previous control.
- cbg
- red
- Posts: 187
- Joined: Mon May 03, 2010 10:45 pm
51 posts
• Page 1 of 4 • 1, 2, 3, 4
Who is online
Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 184 guests