I try to keep out of orienteering politics as much as possible but this issue has really made me think.
Firstly mistakes happen, due to apparent miscommunication within SYO there has been no relay team entered for the womans open. The womans open team, from what I have heard, genuinely believed that they had an entry and had planned their trip up to Scotland. They knew that this was an important race and that the UKRL depended on it. They could have spent the weekend training in Sheffield but are dedicated to the club and wanted a good race.
Secondly, I can understand the reason why they have approached other clubs (according to Ricky Baxter on the suggestion of the Scottish relay champs representative). They were trying to do their best to get a relay run to ensure that their club had a chance of gaining a UKRL victory.
Thirdly-AND MOST IMPORTANTLY! Anthony Squires should NOT be in the position of deciding if he should do the "sportsmanly" thing and offer his relay team to SYO. The organiser/planner of the Scottish relay Championships should have allowed SYO a late entry. Despite what many elites would like to believe orineteering is NOT YET A PROFFESIONAL SPORT.This is not the world athletic champs where a late entry is totally unviable. It is a great sport that needs to attract as many people as possible. As it stands at the moment there are three disillusioned team members who will not orienteer this weekend and a UK relay league that will be decided purely on the fact that the leading team were not allowed a late entry.
At the end of the day we should ask when we cast a vote in this poll- Is this promoting orienteering?
Moral Dilema for your Thursday Afternoon
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but that syo team would be non comp, and also if one of the non int or syo teams win, then it wouldn't b an interlopers win
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rob f - yellow
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its pretty sad really. on BOF tours coaches will stay up for a couple of hours maximum every night and mark up 40 maps (very accurately for the next day).
So if the problem is that the maps have aleady been printed out then it would have taken 30 minutes maximum to mark up 3 more relay maps for SYO womens team, very carefully by hand.
Then maybe someone would have had to input the runners info into the race computers. never having done this myself i would hazard a guess at this taking about 10 minutes?
however before any of this the decision makers would have to swallow their pride which might take considerably longer.
So if the problem is that the maps have aleady been printed out then it would have taken 30 minutes maximum to mark up 3 more relay maps for SYO womens team, very carefully by hand.
Then maybe someone would have had to input the runners info into the race computers. never having done this myself i would hazard a guess at this taking about 10 minutes?
however before any of this the decision makers would have to swallow their pride which might take considerably longer.
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bendover - addict
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This is just stupid. The organisers should give SYO a run. Surely someone could volunteer to mark up a few blank maps. Any victory for INT in these circumstances would be very hollow.
Scottish Champs relay organisers can be the most anal in the world. A few years back.....
Warrior had entered the relay in advance, we had all run in the individual but not read the details. We missed the registration time on the sunday by 3 mins and were behind Marcus Pinker in the queue. The organisers then gave a MP's non competitive relay team our entry (crossing out the name warrior), we protested while this was happening and neither the organisers or the non competitive team would give our entry back.
so in short... good luck SYO!
Jez
Scottish Champs relay organisers can be the most anal in the world. A few years back.....
Warrior had entered the relay in advance, we had all run in the individual but not read the details. We missed the registration time on the sunday by 3 mins and were behind Marcus Pinker in the queue. The organisers then gave a MP's non competitive relay team our entry (crossing out the name warrior), we protested while this was happening and neither the organisers or the non competitive team would give our entry back.
so in short... good luck SYO!
Jez
- Guest
THIS IS STUPID - GIVE SYO A RUN
What's the point of holding a competition if you don't let the best teams run. If Scotland really wants Interlopers to win then why not just hold a race for them on their own - guaranteed medals all round!
And don't give me any bo**ocks about not enough maps - that's just crap - make some more.
But then I guess noone ever heard about being FLEXIBLE!
And don't give me any bo**ocks about not enough maps - that's just crap - make some more.
But then I guess noone ever heard about being FLEXIBLE!
- sarah R
It is in deed a regretable situation, but before all the accusations fly I wonder what steps SYO have taken to get their own house in order before calling for the Scottish relay organisers to do so. It's all very well mouthing off at this stage but the whole thing could have been easily avoided - it is now a no-win situation.
Personally I've never subscribed to the "hollow victory" argument. The vagueries of life conspire to produce injuries,delays, other commitments and sometime getting to the start line itself is as hard as completing the course for one reason or another - it's potentially the same for everyone and to protest otherwise is just whingeing.
Personally I've never subscribed to the "hollow victory" argument. The vagueries of life conspire to produce injuries,delays, other commitments and sometime getting to the start line itself is as hard as completing the course for one reason or another - it's potentially the same for everyone and to protest otherwise is just whingeing.
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Mrs H. - nope godmother
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Mrs H. wrote:I wonder what steps SYO have taken to get their own house in order before calling for the Scottish relay organisers to do so.
See the post from the SYO press office in the UKRL forum!!!!!!!
'They couldn't hit an elephant at this dist.....' Last words of General John Sedgewick, 1864.
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Mike - orange
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FVO are one of the clubs that does have an entry for the Women's Open Relay this Sunday.
We are also one of the 'Scottish West Area' clubs helping with the organisation (although our involvement is on the Saturday).
I have made it clear to Sunday's Planner and Controller that we would prefer to see SYO given an entry for the Women's Relay.
Up to the other clubs entered - CLYDE (who are also a West Area club), EUOC, INT and BOK - whether they wish to do likewise.
I hope the SYO runners are travelling up anyway - we will all look very silly if you do get a late entry and then it is not used!
Jon
We are also one of the 'Scottish West Area' clubs helping with the organisation (although our involvement is on the Saturday).
I have made it clear to Sunday's Planner and Controller that we would prefer to see SYO given an entry for the Women's Relay.
Up to the other clubs entered - CLYDE (who are also a West Area club), EUOC, INT and BOK - whether they wish to do likewise.
I hope the SYO runners are travelling up anyway - we will all look very silly if you do get a late entry and then it is not used!
Jon
- Jon X
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Mike wrote:See the post from the SYO press office in the UKRL forum!!!!!!!
Yes I've read that - but I guess it doesn't actually mean much unless you're a member of SYO. I merely suggest a little more humility and a little less aggression might further SYO's case. We all know this has got nothing to do with map numbers.
It would be incredibly noble of interlopers to give SYO their entry - and in my book that would mean SYO should run and then declare themselves non-competitive - but I don't suppose any of them would be willing to travel up to Scotland to do that.
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Mrs H. - nope godmother
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In the interests of good sportsmanship clearly SYO should be given a run.
SYO should display equal sportsmanship by failing to score sufficient points to beat INT in the UKRL ( I guess that means failing to punch at some point)
SYO should display equal sportsmanship by failing to score sufficient points to beat INT in the UKRL ( I guess that means failing to punch at some point)
If you could run forever ......
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Kitch - god
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I have to agree, orienteering is about having fun NOT ABOUT POLITICS. The team that wins the league should win it by orienteering better than other teams - not by a technicality.
Yeah - late entries shouldn't be allowed in general, if it is obvious that the person/team is just lazy, but this is a genuine mistake - not lazyness.
So give SYO the run
Yeah - late entries shouldn't be allowed in general, if it is obvious that the person/team is just lazy, but this is a genuine mistake - not lazyness.
So give SYO the run
Now, I know you're a feminist, and I think that's adorable, but this is grown-up time and I'm the man.
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Braddie - light green
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Sarah,
Don't think it's anything to do with Scotland wanting Interlopers to win... best way for INT to win is to beat everyone during the series. INT missed out at the Harvester coz lots of them were in Lithuania. Looks like SYO will miss the Scottish... but not by thier choice... that makes the entire competition a bit of a joke:)
If I was in charge of INT... I would decide to win the Scottish because it's the Scottish but declare the team N/C for UKRL.... leaving the results as they stand just now.....
Don't think it's anything to do with Scotland wanting Interlopers to win... best way for INT to win is to beat everyone during the series. INT missed out at the Harvester coz lots of them were in Lithuania. Looks like SYO will miss the Scottish... but not by thier choice... that makes the entire competition a bit of a joke:)
If I was in charge of INT... I would decide to win the Scottish because it's the Scottish but declare the team N/C for UKRL.... leaving the results as they stand just now.....
- gross2004
I'm not sure of all the facts regarding the mix up in communication within SYO and need to be careful not to attribute blame to any party invloved but still feel the need to comment.
In my opinion the saddest part of this whole episode is the fact that, even if SYO do now get an entry, as far as I understand only one of our top four (British Squad) girls who were all fiercely competing for places in the JK Relay team intend to travel to Scotland. I know individuals all have thier own priorities, and for international athletes the Scottish relays must fall quite a long way down that list of priorities, but it is a shame that the intention of the UK Relay league in creating an extra competitive edge for the major relays in the UK doesn't seem to be working.
Charlie.
In my opinion the saddest part of this whole episode is the fact that, even if SYO do now get an entry, as far as I understand only one of our top four (British Squad) girls who were all fiercely competing for places in the JK Relay team intend to travel to Scotland. I know individuals all have thier own priorities, and for international athletes the Scottish relays must fall quite a long way down that list of priorities, but it is a shame that the intention of the UK Relay league in creating an extra competitive edge for the major relays in the UK doesn't seem to be working.
Charlie.
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