Peter Palmer Relays

[kedge]

Just to point out to awk that the Dorset Coath Path Relay he alludes to, and which is always run on the Saturday after the August Bank Holiday, is a major event in the life of the SW Junior squad. The event starts from the Cobb at Lyme Regis and the coast path is followed until the team runs into the sea at Shell Bay at Studland. It gets everyone together at the beginning of the season and some of the legs are not for the faint-hearted, with huge amounts of climb on them, so its a fairly major training run.

More importantly, because the relay is a sponsored race for the the SWJS, and there is a donation/entry fee from all the SW clubs who also run it, it is a major source of fund raising for the SW Junior Squad, who often have to travel long distances to attend events. It would be a great pity if, because of fixture congestion, the Peter Palmer event is time tabled against it.

[Rich]

Well done to AIRE, :

Yes well done AIRE, great performance. We'll let you have the trophy on loan for a year

[awk]

Just to point out to awk that the Dorset Coath Path Relay he alludes to, and which is always run on the Saturday after the August Bank Holiday, is a major event in the life of the SW Junior squad. .....It would be a great pity if, because of fixture congestion, the Peter Palmer event is time tabled against it.

So a "fairly major training run" should take precedence over one of the major national orienteering fixture for juniors? Seems an odd way to prioritise things. However important locally, and however enshrined in the calendar, the Dorset coast path relay is a local running event. From an orienteering perspective (i.e. the one any orienteering squad or group should be taking), the fixtures clash is the other way round, and the PPR is timetabled before any local event. It would be far more unfortunate for SW juniors to lose the experience of the PPR than for those at the event to lose the 2 teams (out of 32) who were there this year.

I do hope that those juniors and clubs who do want to attend the PPR are encouraged in doing so. It would be a real pity if the cart of team building and fund raising was put before the horse of the juniors' own orienteering development (incidentally what about those juniors not in the junior squad from clubs in the associaton? Are they to miss out? After all, the PPR is a major team builder for club squads, and has the added advantage of being about orienteering).

[ifititches]

Dorset coast path sounds fantastic, but have it from local source that it takes the number of teams that attended PPs this year for the event to break even financially, so even loss of two teams would make a difference to viability.

Also (I think) need at least this many for atmosphere/interest at finish etc, and for image of junior orienteering as sport. To ensure attendance this year Twin Peak obligingly moved their date, and can imagine density of autumnn fixtures will always make it difficult to avoid clashes with other non-O fixtures.

[Iain]

Sorry Bedders, that was my misinformation, not my mum's, that said that! I just assumed Andy had pulled up again seeing as the last time I saw NOC they were well down, and the commentary was too rubbish to tell me otherwise! Sorry Peter B!

Good commentary is not (quality) music with some crazed girl reading out team numbers...at least try and guess the club from the kit they're wearing!

Becks,

I'm sorry that you seem to have been so dissapointed by the commentry, however, the young lady who did the majority of it was the only person after an extensive search with enough good will to volenteer and show up and do it. She also spent a good many hours making up a playlist which would not annoy any paticular age group, however this also seems to have been a waisted effort.

Her job was made no easier by the fact that most teams didnt even bother to return the commernty information sheets handed out to each team upon registration, she had 5 returned out of 32 handed out.

As she was the only person doing commentry and relaying team numbers from the final control over the PA she couldnt even get across to the results caravan to get any up to date info.

If you would like to volenteer for such a job in the future then Im sure the organisers would love to hear from you, but in the mean time, please dont knock the volenters on which our sport depends.

[Becks]

I was thinking of going and taking over, but seeing as i wasn't supposed to be even going to event till Thursday volunteering before hand was a bit silly.

And she did seem to be enjoying the dancing so much!

[Simon]

So a "fairly major training run" should take precedence over one of the major national orienteering fixture for juniors?

The current date for next years PPs (4th September) is only provisional. The DCP can be moved (and also other orienteering events), but this only becomes an option if someone comes forward saying that the PPs will definitely happen on a certain date (volunteers respond to Peter Guillaume or regional fixtures person). However it seems pointless thinking about moving the DCP (or any other event) if the PPs are not definitely going to happen on that weekend. The sooner the date is fixed the less we have an issue with clashes.

incidentally what about those juniors not in the junior squad from clubs in the associaton? Are they to miss out? After all, the PPR is a major team builder for club squads, and has the added advantage of being about orienteering

The DCP allows for juniors to run in their club teams as well as with the SWJS. This means that it acts as a very good club team building event.

[Becks]

I wasn't being sarcy about the music btw, it was great. Old Manics and Joy Division...mmm....think it went over my juniors heads though as I was jumping about in the dawn to Love will Tear Us Apart!

[Becks]

One last post...sorry! If you wanted help with the commentary all you had to do was come on here and ask. I'd have been willing to provide banter if I only knew you were struggling and I'm sure there were others who would also offer.

The thing is, in a relay like this, good commentary is vital to know what's going on and lift the atmosphere of the event. It was a great event, but it could have been amazing.

[Neil Crickmore]

Last year's PP was cancelled apparently due to the lack of both entries and helpers. This year our Junior team manager offered my services once my chaperoning services has effectively finished at lights out. The organisers suggested I do some control patrolling. I duly turned up at the start of the race but it was clear that there was no plan in place for patrolling. It was initially suggested that I walk round the red courses backwards before a change of plan resulted in me patrolling the controls around the field being used for the sponsored walk the next day. Fortunately there were no problems and I spent an interesting couple of hours watching competitors flow through this part of the course. My impression of that part of the map was that it was certainly showing its age but probably just about OK for the event.

We were one of the clubs that did fill in the commentary forms and so it was disappointing that these were not used. The results processing was very good but again it was a shame that there was not more interaction with commentary. Clearly manpower was a problem which I felt resulted in what could have been an excellent event becoming a basically OK one. The PP should be one of the highlights of the junior racing calendar, Sutton park is a good venue but perhaps it should become more of a joint venture between COBOC and other WM clubs. Naturally there will always be discussions about the format of the event and whether or not four regional small clubs should combine to form another small club but that is something for the rules committee to consider. I did note though that despite the rules saying that the competition was for M/W12-M/W18 competitors, and my then M10 son being refused an entry two years ago, that there were some competitors outside this range competing at the weekend. Perhaps in the future the lower age range could become a guideline rather than a rule since everything possible should be done to encourage teams to enter this event.

[Guest]

Neil Crickmore commented
"Sutton park is a good venue but perhaps it should become more of a joint venture between COBOC and other WM clubs"

Neil is right about COBOC not being able to put the event on themselves. A very small number of active adults keep this small club alive to give juniors in the City of Birmingham support with their orienteering. Those adults and their offspring (where appropriate )were the crucial people in the organisation and resurrection of the event. However the event would not have taken place without the help and support of HOC. However it might or might not surprise you to find tit is difficult to find volunteers who don't have children associated with the event. Also as the event is straight after the summer break it seems to be even harder to find these volunteers. There was one HOC member who manned the finish in case of the need to determine the winning team, who turned up at 4:00 having probably travelled for 45 minutes, and did not have a child taking part. That is dedication for you. It's hard to get volunteers for junior only events because volunteers like to have a run if they've travelled X miles to help, never mind got up at 3:00 in the morning.

Perhaps there should be more call for parents from within the region whose children are taking part to help. However of course the children don't really want their parents around, that's part of the attraction of the event. It's catch 22

One observation hinted at by Neil was a lack of coordination, by COBOC. This was the case, I think there man power was so stretched that this person was missing, and possibly this co-ord might have prevented some of the problems. The planner/controller, were very aware of the security issue re SI boxes and thus did not put them all out initially, unfortunatly they misjudged the speed of the leading youngsters.

Earlier in the day.the organising team were battling to keep the marker streams in place due to ignorant local youths who thought pinching bits of tape was a great game. This only further stretched man power, and tempers I suspect!

Hocolite

[Blanka]

Her job was made no easier by the fact that most teams didnt even bother to return the commernty information sheets handed out to each team upon registration, she had 5 returned out of 32 handed out.

Just checked, and the plastic folders we were given with team registration included a sheet called 'last minute notes for team managers' and a map of Sutton Town Centre for getting food, plus a football registration form. I don't think there was anything about the commentary on the sheet I filled in right there at registering which included SI numbers, and names of leg-runners.

So the reason for not having any commentary sheets in filled out for either WAOC team was because we weren't given one. (Admittedly, I did go and register right at the start, at 5pm, so maybe the registration team hadn't quite had the sheets to hand to give out...)

Blanka

[ifititches]

two extra HOC parents came at 9.30pm and slept over to get up at 4am and help with safety patrols; several other dedicated HOC members would normally also have helped, but don't have school-age children, so have their holidays in September. I expect same goes for other clubs in W.Mids, where so many leading organisers are already deep into JK 2005 preparations too.That probably reflects age distribution of those who play a major role in keeping O going in the W.Mids. I think COBOC did a fantastic job, with enormous good humour!

I understand that one problem with getting commentary at PPs is that most areas with the good nearby sleeping facilities are likely to be too close to residential areas for music and commentary to start at 4.30am, or even to happen at all. Well done COBOC for getting permission for that in Sutton Park!

[Guest]

The sheets wern't in the registration back, as they were only drawn up at the 11th hour when we reailsed who would be doing the commentry, and were taken to the registration team shortly after the opening, so WAOC are hereby excused and will not need a letter from their parents explaining the absesnce of this document, and on that count, simalarly there would have been one or two other teams who also didnt get one however, there were 40 copies made of the sheet concerned and the registration team (2 very dilergent individuals) assured me (when i went back at about 8pm after trying to sort out the accomodation problems)that every team that had come through had been given one. and there were only 3 sheets left. when registration closed.

The case of the missing sheets continues.

[Iain]

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